Genealogy Chat

I am trying to obtain a marriage certificate (or proof of marriage) of my Paternal Grandmother and Grandfather - believed they met and married in Kenya circa 1930.
Also they then went on to have by Aunt circa 1937 and father in 1939.
My grandfather died in Kenya in 1938-1939 whilst working on the railways as an engineer prior to my fathers birth.
GRO has no trace in England and Wales or Overseas and Kenya are distinctly unhelpful unless I can supply a copy of the certificates which defeats the object.

Any ideas?

Craig :-(

Worth an email?
http://www.kenyasociety.org/

Were they British nationals?
I think FMP (Findmypast) has overseas BMD's, worth putting their names on here in case anyone can locate them for you.
Jan

Good Morning Craig and Welcome to the Community boards.

If you give us some names to work on we may be able to help you.

Or the Kenyan Embassy here in the UK may be able to advise

Thanks for all the suggestions I will be following them up.

First and foremost if I can track down my father and aunts birth certificates in Kenya then I will obtain my grandmothers maiden name (believed possibly Wagstaffe).

My father - Frank Spencer Buckley bn 13/02/1939, Kenya.
My Aunt - Shirley Elizabeth Buckley bn 12/07/1935, Kenya.

Grandparents - Frank Spencer Buckley (may be Spencer Frank Buckley)
Gertrude May (possibly Wagtsaffe)
Believed both bn circa 1908 and then married in Kenya circa 1930-35.

my grandfather was known to have worked on the railways as an engineer and died before the birth of my father in late 1938 / early 1939.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Don't know if relevant?

Name: Gertrude May Buckley<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Birth Date: 6 May 1903<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Date of Registration: Dec 1970
Age at Death: 67
Registration district: Surrey North Western
Inferred County: Surrey
Volume: 5g
Page: 690

Travelling to Britain in 1933 as a married couple.

Name: Mrs Gertrude May Buckley
Birth Date: abt 1903
Age: 30
Port of Departure: Beira, Mozambique
Arrival Date: 22 Dec 1933
Port of Arrival: London, England
Ports of Voyage: Beira
[Dar-es-Salaam]
[Zanzibar]
[Mombasa]
Ship Name: Malda
Search Ship Database: View the 'Malda' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Shipping line: British India Steam Navigation Company Ltd
Official Number: 146286

Travelling with her is husband Frank Buckley aged 31 civil engineer, proposed uk address given as c/o Chapman 43 Harewood Ave Bournemouth. Kenya given as last country of residence.

Gertrude and the children travelling to Britain in 1937:

Name: Gertrude M Buckley
Birth Date: abt 1903
Age: 34
Port of Departure: Beira, Mozambique
Arrival Date: 27 May 1937
Port of Arrival: London, England
Ports of Voyage: Beira
[Dar-es-Salaam]
[Zanzibar]
[Mombasa]
Ship Name: Madura
Search Ship Database: View the 'Madura' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Shipping line: British India Steam Navigation Company Ltd
Official Number: 146268

Gertrude M aged 34, Shirley E aged 2, and Frank S aged 3 mos - this gives him a birth date two years earlier than you stated?<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Travelling to the same address as before 43 Harewood Ave, Bournemouth.

EDIT: Does earlier birth date for your father imply an earlier death date than you previously thought, for your paternal grandfather?

?????

Speculative going by the C/O Chapman on first trip, and Gertrude's possible date of birth on death index:

Births Jun 1903 Chapman Gertrude May Leicester 7a 319

No Gertrude May Wagstaffe birth for same period - however I don't know how strong your evidence is for the belief that her maiden name may have been Wagstaffe.



Census 1911 for Gertrude May Chapman

Sherwood Hendford Hill Yeovil, Yeovil, Somerset, England

Arthur Edgar Chapman Head Married Male 43 1868 Pambroke Haverfordwest Engineer Electrical

Ann Eleanor Chapman Wife Married Female 42 1869 Leicestershire Narborough -

Florence Grace Chapman Daughter Single Female 17 1894 Norfolk North Wilsham School

Constance Marjorie Chapman Daughter - Female 13 1898 Leicestershire Leicester

Harold Victor Chapman Son - Male 10 1901 Leicestershire Leicester School

Gertrude May Chapman Daughter - Female 7 1904 Leicestershire Leicester<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Mabel Emily Louisa Hannah Servant Single Female 17 1894 London Holloway General Servant Domestic

EDIT: They say they have been married 14 years and 3 children born of the marriage, all still living. As four children are listed, and the eldest child Florence, is aged 17, presumably she predates the marriage of Arthur Edgar to Ann Eleanor

Marriages Mar 1897
Chapman Arthur Edgar Blaby 7a 57<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Dawkins Ann Eleanor Blaby 7a 57 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Scott Percy Blaby 7a 57
Townsend Lizzie Blaby 7a 57

Frank and Gertrude married in England!!!!!!!!!!!

England & Wales, Marriage Index, 1916-2005
Name: Frank Buckley
Spouse Surname: Chapman
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1930
Registration district: Bournemouth
Inferred County: Dorset
Volume Number: 2b
Page Number: 1788
Find Spouse:Gertrude M Chapman Buckley Oct-Nov-Dec 1930 Bournemouth Dorset

England & Wales, Marriage Index, 1916-2005
Name: Gertrude M Chapman
Spouse Surname: Buckley
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1930
Registration district: Bournemouth
Inferred County: Dorset
Volume Number: 2b
Page Number: 1788

If your order the marriage cert, it should help confirm whether I have the right parents for Gertrude in census 1911, and hopefully if it gives a name and occupation for Frank's father, it might help you track Frank down on census 1911 as well.

Frank was listed as aged 31 on the 1933 journey back to Britain, but as it's not an uncommon name, you could do with any information provided by his marriage cert to try and narrow down the field of possibilities.

OK - I'm struggling here.

I found this entry for Frank S Buckley travelling to Britain:

Name: Frank S Buckley
Birth Date: abt 1901
Age: 36
Port of Departure: Beira, Mozambique
Arrival Date: 27 May 1937
Port of Arrival: London, England
Ports of Voyage: Beira
[Dar-es-Salaam]
[Zanzibar]
[Mombasa]
Ship Name: Madura
Search Ship Database: View the 'Madura' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Shipping line: British India Steam Navigation Company Ltd
Official Number: 146268

This is the same voyage that Gertrude, Shirley and Frank S. aged 3 mos were on. The image, as far as I can see, only shows Frank S aged 3 mos, not Frank S aged 36 years.

I'll send you the image by pm so you can see what you make of it. :-S

The 3 mos is in the column for infants.

I have no idea if this refers to your Frank Buckley either, may be a complete red herring. No other Buckleys listed with him, and he is described as 'scholar'. Last Country of residence, British East Africa.

Name: Master Frank Buckley<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Birth Date: abt 1902<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Age: 11
Port of Departure: Durban, South Africa
Arrival Date: 2 Nov 1913
Port of Arrival: London, England
Ports of Voyage: Beira
[Mombasa]
Ship Name: Gaika
Search Ship Database: View the 'Gaika' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Shipping line: Union-Castle Mail Steamship Company Ltd
Official Number: 106908

Kucinta,

Thankyou so much for your excellent investigations - as you can onviously see I am only starting out out on this tree and have never done this before, relying on very limited resources from obvious websites.

The info re Gertrude Chapman appears to be correct as I know she had an older sister named Constance.

It is amazing how little snippetts of family history thought to be true can lead one astray.

All you have researched seems to be spot on - I cannot thank you enough - I was a bit sceptical about these threads and requests at first but wow what a powerful tool.

Once again Thankyou with all my heart.

Hi Craig,

Just to say it's always worth bringing your 'brick walls' to the thread, the folk here on Genes R love to get their teeth into a knotty problem, and we can bounce ideas off each other, triggering new lines of pursuit etc,

It's up to you to assess what we find, and do any verification needed.

I would very strongly urge that you send for that marriage cert.

You can order it online from:

http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/

It costs £9.25

You have the GRO ref in the information I supplied above

Year & Qtr: Oct-Nov-Dec 1930

District: Bournemouth Dorset

Vol number : 2b

Page number: 1788

There is an obituary for Frank Buckley in the Kenya Gazette page 1516 Dec 22 1936

Government Notice no 801

" His excellency the High Commissioner for Transport deeply regrets to record the death at the European Hospital Nairobi of Mr Frank Buckley on 4th Dec 1936.

Mr Buckley held an appointment of Assistant Engineer and had been in the Kenya and Uganda Railways and Harbours service since the 26th Feb 1924. he proved himself to be a most loyal and capable officer, consistently zealous in the performance of his duties. His death is a severe loss to the Railways and Harbours Administration and will be mourned by a large circle of friends.

I've pmed the link to the image as when I added it here it made the whole page go way wide., so I took it off again.

Could this be Frank heading out to Africa in 1923? (from FMP).

First name(s) F<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Last name BUCKLEY<<<<<<<<<<<<
Title MR
Gender Male
Age 20
Birth year 1903
Occupation C ENGINEER<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Departure year 1923
Departure day 22
Departure month 2
Departure port LONDON
Destination port MOMBASA
Destination MOMBASA
Country KENYA
Destination country KENYA
Ship name GUILDFORD CASTLE
Ship official number 132611
Ship master's first name T H
Ship master's last name WILFORD
Shipping line UNION-CASTLE MAIL S/S COY LTD
City LONDON
Ship destination port DURBAN (PORT NATAL)
Ship destination country SOUTH AFRICA
Ship registered tonnage 8036
Number of passengers 132
Record set Passenger Lists leaving UK 1890-1960
Category Travel & migration
Record collection Passenger lists
Collections from Australasia, Great Britain, Ireland, United States

His last address in the UK was 471 Garton Road Reddish Stockport..

Travellin 2nd Class. C. Engineer aged 20 heading for Mombasa.Country of Future intended residence : UGANDA.

EDIT: EXTREMELY speculative, based only on the 471 Garton Road Reddish Stockport. for F Buckley.

Births Dec 1902 BUCKLEY Frank Stockport 8a 45

Second EDIT: Nope, definitely not the birth of your chap as sadly:

Deaths Mar 1903 Buckley Frank 0 Stockport 8a 68