Find Ancestors

Hi can anybody help me please, i have posted before as i have been trying to find my great grandfather, i have census records for him 1911 and 1901 i also have his marriage record and his death record, but i cannot find a birth record or anything prior to 1901, i have been online and ordered his birth certificate but again this has proved fruitless as one cannot be found and the only explanation is he was probably adopted or abandoned at birth. His name was Alfred Henry Payton the 1911 and 1901 census shows his birthplace as Clerkenwell London c1867, as i said i have posted before for info on alfred and i have the marriage and death etc also his children and wife details but i need to know how do i find out any more info as according to all sources he did not exist before 1901

Have you looked for him on earlier census records as Henry

Not unusual for the child to use middle name if the same name as father

Oh I remember this now

Father on marriage cert is Alfred - relief stamper

HH

Could you please stick to one thread on this family you have at least four now

Just add something to the bottom if you want to bring it back to the top

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/thread/1271141

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/thread/1268600

If you look at one of the other threads Amokavid you will see a lot of work has already been done and HH has been asked more than once not to duplicate

jax

completing the set

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/thread/1268712


maybe if you ask one ... more ... time ... jax ...

I did state that i was asking for help finding adoption records not records for alfred im not trying to jump any thread que maybe im just thick !!!! sorry if i have offended or wasted any ones time

if you read the post pinned at the top of this board ... it is really very simple ...

for one person, one post

not one post for the person's marriage, one for their birth, one for their daughter ............. it actually says one post for a family, this is obvious in this case, everything in the post about the daughter related to the father too, why would you let people research the same things all over again ?

there was no adoption before 1927

since your Alfred first appears with his 1894 marriage ? it seems most likely that he was the one who changed his own name as an adult

please go back to your thread and add to it that you still want help

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/thread/1271141

and do not continue this one ........ or start yet another one ..........

HH,

As far as I can see nobody who has replied to your several threads has advised you of what could be an explanation as to why you have been unable to obtain the birth record of Alfred Henry Payton.

Although civil registration began in England on 1/7/1837 the registration of a birth was the responsibility of the local registrar, not the parent(s) of the child. It was only in 1874 that the 1874 Births and Deaths Registration Act made registration of a birth by the child's parent or the occupier of the premises where the birth occurred compulsory. Failure to register a birth within 42 days resulted in a fine of £2.

It is a well known and acknowledged fact that many births that occurred between 1837~1874 went unregistered. Even after 1874 many parents shared the common belief that the baptism of the child equated with registering the birth.

Your Alfred Henry Payton's birth c1867 may simply have been one of those that was not registered. Whilst you have not as yet found a certificate of his birth that fact alone should not be taken as a clear indication that he was abandoned at birth or adopted.

Good luck with your research.

unfortunately that does not explain his absence from the censuses in 1871 and 1881 and 1891 under the name in which his marriage is registered or in any other guise that can be found .....................

I wonder why we are continuing to add to this most recent in the string of multiple threads about the same thing

Chrissie,

Firstly, I made my post on this thread because it was the most recent that HH had made and therefore the most likely to be the one that the poster would return to.

Secondly, Whilst the content of my post does not explain why efforts to find the person in earlier census returns under the name that he married under have failed it does at least offer a possible explanation as to why the poster has not yet been successful in obtaining his birth record.

Thirdly, I accept that a duplicated post can and often does cause duplication of effort for those willing to try to assist a poster. In this instance however I think that the poster made a reasonable effort to prevent that occurring. They mentioned that they had posted about the person previously. They mentioned which records they already had about him, his wife and his children. They had formulated an opinion (Which may be or not be correct) that the absence of a birth record indicated that he was probably adopted or abandoned at birth. My post simply advised the original poster that there may be another logical reason why she had been unable to find his birth registration.

I sometimes wonder whether the time and effort expended by some GR members in locating much earlier threads and then proclaiming the latest post "DUPLICATE" might not be better spent.

May I correct you on one point that you made in an earlier post on this thread:

"there was no adoption before 1927"

The Adoption Act 1926 legally formalised adoption but the practice of adopting children had been in existence for many years prior to that.

perhaps we should just report the threads instead to save all of them being replied on

jax

I wonder many things Jonesey .......... I seldom feel compelled to announce them on these boards ..........

the poster made no effort to avoid duplication despite having been repeatedly advised to use his existing thread(s) and stop starting new ones

announcing that one has posted a request before goes no distance to informing other members what searches have been made before and what the results were ...... this being the relevant information needed

as for adoption, the poster appears to be searching for adoption RECORDS and since there was no legal provision for adoption before the act you cite there will be no such RECORDS so the way I phrased my reply was really all that was required

Jax and Chrissie,

I do not believe that this thread is the right place for us to discuss any differences of opinion that we may have with one another about this thread or indeed about any other matter. I am however perfectly willing to discuss them privately so if either or both of you wish to discuss the matter further please feel free to contact me by PM.

Oh, the things I see whilst doing 'my rounds'.


Just in case anyone has missed this:


http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/thread/1274324


I will send HH a message in an effort to help them understand how these boards work.


Cx

Jonesey perhaps you will delete your personal comments then, since any 'differences of opinion' in this thread are only those that you put here