Find Ancestors

Please be patient with this newbie. I am not asking for searches, merely guidance from a caring, experienced, researcher!!!

I am living overseas (Middle East) so physically getting to parish records is a no-no at the moment and I am relying on internet search engines.

I have a grandfather's name of Joseph White, who I know married a Lilian Wilson in 1928 and I have guestimated his birth to be around 1903. I have obtained the marriage cert for this pair, and have found the father of Jospeh who is also called Joseph. Joseph Snr is listed as a blacksmith. I have searched the 1901 census and found a Joseph White (profession of Blacksmith) and his wife Susannah living in the Hackney district (St Luke's, City Road). I have also searched the birth index for possible births of Joseph Snr, and of course will do the same for Joseph Jnr.

(on the marriage cert of Joseph Jnr and Lilian one of the witnesses is Henry White - my father-in-law seems to remember an uncle named Harry - as someone experienced would you assume that Henry/Harry are one and the same?)

Where do I go from here?
I only ask that someone give me a gentle nudge in the right direction as to where I should take this and what I should look for.

Grateful for any guidance and thanks in advance!
Luisha

ps, I am 4 hours ahead of UK, so please don't be offended if I don't respond to any response I receive immediately!

how old was Joseph white Jnr when he married?
where did he marry?

The first thing to remember is the golden rule - NEVER 'assume'. !!!

I have had a whole seperate tree going back several generations for one of my husban'd relatives, but I will not add it as, although I 'know' everything fits and I 'know' it is the correct one it all hinges on a John Wilson being the correct one - I have his birth cert, his marriage cert, and his parents marriage cert and everything proved going backwards but there is no ABSOLUTE proof that he is the same one so the tree remains 'seperate' until I find it !

Take what you have and explore EVERYTHING !

The witnesses can be very useful - the name Harry is very often used for a Henry so it is possibly the same one - Who is the other witness? - Very often a member of one of the families, or, if the other witness is female, have you looked for a marriage for her to Henry (witnesses were also often 'couple')

Look at the addresses on the cert and see if you can link them.

Look on Ancestry for Joseph Snr. in WW1 Military Records - If his record is there, it often shows nnext of kin - marriage details and dates for births of children.

Historical Directories also can help, although they only go up to 1914:

http://www.historicaldirectories.org/

Also, you could look to see if anyone left a will :

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/

There are lots of other places to look but you need first to confirm that the Blacksmith you found on 1901 is the correct Joseph.

Dea x

Hi Minnie,

Joseph Jnr was 25 years at marriage and he and Lily married in St Peter's church in the parish of Clerkenwell. Residence at the time of marriage was Upper Charles Street.
I have looked on google maps and found a New Charles Street in the area, but no Upper Charles Street.
regards
Luisha

The couple you found on 1901 seem to have married in Holborn - Sept Q 1900 - Ref 1b 1482
- Joseph White to Susanna JUDD.

From 1911 onwards mothers maiden name appears on birth registers so if this is the correct couple for your Joseph Jnr, it is likely that this is a brother:

Births Jun 1912

White Herbert ( mmn Judd ) Holborn 1b 1162

Did 'your' Joseph have a brother called Herbert?

Dea x

Thanks Dea,
but how do I prove that the blacksmith on the census was the same as the one on the cert.??? (sorry am I being stupid!!)

I know from the research that I have carried out on Lily side that the other witness (William Tingey) married Lily's sister Dorothy Clara K Wilson.

All of the addresses are in the Hackney area of London (I'm sorry but I'm from a small village in the west of England orignally, so London is also a bit baffling to me). I have looked at all addresses that I have and they are all in and around Lever Street/City Road London.

My father-in-Law seemed to recall his father living in the Guiness Buildings in London, and I have also found these in Lever Street.
On the 1901 census Joseph White the Blacksmith was recorded as being born St Luke's London, and living at the time of the census in Ironmonger Street. I have found an Ironmonger Row - again it is just off Lever Street.

regards
Luisha
x

Dea,

I only know that he had a brother called Harry who was married to a lady called Frany (short I think for Frances/Francis). I don't know if there were others.

I was working on the basis that normally the first born son is named after the father, and so Joseph Jnr would possibly have been the first born. I then made the assumption that his birth (from the marriage cert) being 1903 parents would have married slightly before that date (say from approx. 2/3 years previously). BUT I do realise that this is all assumption and take on board what you said previously about assumptions!!
Also - I did find that the birth for Lily was only a couple of months or so after her parents married!!!!

Luisha
x

Hi,

No, you are not being 'stupid'.

This is exactly the situation I have with my John Wilson - I 'know' it will prove to be the same one but it has to be proved !!

I know of many many people who have added such links to their tree and have ended up with 'hundreds' of ancestore who are just not correct!

I will have a 'little explore' for you just to see if I can connect them.

Can you let me have any further details you may have - I will need to work forward before I can work back (If you see what I mean).

As some of these details will be of 'living' people, you may not want to put them up on this board so you can pm them to me if you wish.

Best wishes,

Dea x

I will be going to collect my children from school very shortly and then doing the 'mum's taxi service' thing to various after school activities, I have not left the site - only taken a short leave - I will be back asap.
Luisha

It is quite possible your 'Harry' is actually Herbert?

If i were you i'd look for a 'Herbert' marriage and see if it links to Francis....