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Hi Sylvia

Thank you for your help.I have more of an understanding of how the census works from your comments.

There is still a lot of misunderstanding that Robert did not marry Eliza Smith.But the certificates will prove this.Regards Ann

Thank you for your comments.I am going to purchase certificates.

What happened to your other thread about this woman?

The one on TTF which proved that in 1840 Robert Dale married Eliza Smith...........

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1149575

You were advised to purchase the cert, to find out if either of them had been married previously........

Ann

Ages on a census are upto 2 years out when compared to the actual birthdate

............... it depends on the time of year when the census was taken vs the birth date.


The enumerator at the time asked how old a person was on the date of the census, then this age was translated into a birth year by the modern day transcriber

That is why we all say ABT 1812 when referring to census ages ...... and almost always search for someone on the census by putting 1812 +/- 5 years, to be sure.


So your birth date of 1812 is well in synch with a census age of ABT 1811


Don't get hung up on ages on official documents .................. after all many of our ancestors didn't even really know how old they actually were! It just was not improtant to them ..... and most of them were illiterate anyway



I think the ONLY thing you can do is sepnd £7 to buy the marriage certificate. There is no other way that I can think of to prove who Robert Dale married.


In fact, buying certificates for any marriage or birth is the only way to be sure that anyone has the correct spouses/parents.



sylvia

Hi Sylvia

Eliza Webster could have been born in 1811 but I have it in my tree as 1812.She was born in Parwich.Parents are William and Lucy as shown in your 1841 census.I have a copy of the 1851 census you have obtained showing Eliza Dale-----year of birth abt 1811.
But I am still unsure if Eliza in 1851 census married to Robert Dale is Eliza Webster or Eliza Smith.Looks as though I will have to do what you suggest and order certificates to solve the matter.Ann

I suggest you bite the bullet and order a birth certificate for one of the Robert Dale/Eliza children.


I'm thinking that Eliza Webster b.ca 1812 migh have been married before, that her marriage to Robert Dale was ths her second marriage.

You could buy that marriage certifcate, and it would state on there whether Eliza Smith was a widow or single, and give the name of her father

The birth certificate for one of the children should say the maiden anme of the mother.

Each certificate would cost £7, but it may be money well spent to solve the problem.


Registraiton of some of the children:-

Births Jun 1845 (>99%)

DALE Fanny Ashborne 19 377


Births Mar 1848 (>99%)

DALE George Henry Smith Ashbourne 19 540



Births Jun 1851 (>99%)

Dale Anthony Berrisford Ashbourne 19 457




sylvia

so, in 1851, we have two Eliza's born in parwich, one born ca 1811, and one born ca 1816.

This is the one born ca 1811

1851 Census

Name: Eliza Dale
Age: 40
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1811
Relation: Wife
Spouse's name: Robert
Gender: Female
Where born: Parwich, Derbyshire, England

Civil Parish: Shirley
County/Island: Derbyshire
Country: England

Registration district: Ashborne
Sub-registration district: Brailsford

Robert Dale 43 Farmer of 64 acres
Eliza Dale 40
Robert Dale 9
Elizabeth Dale 7
Fanny Dale 5
George Dale 3
Anthony Dale 1 Mo
Reuben Dale 30
Priscilla Bottom 15
Ann Wibberley 30




sylvia

Just to get my head into this family, and for reference purposes .... is this William and Lucy in 1841???


1841 Census

Name: William Webster
Age: 59
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1782
Gender: Male
Where born: Derbyshire, England

Civil Parish: Parwich
Hundred: Wirksworth
County/Island: Derbyshire
Country: England

Registration district: Ashborne
Sub-registration district: Brassington

William Webster 59 Butcher
Lucy Webster 50 b.ca 1791, Derbyshire
James Webster 26
Ann Webster 24
Joseph Webster 18
Sarah Webster 12
George Webster 10
Charity Webster 8

Address:- Parwich




According to the 1851 Census, the two children at home (George and Charity) were both born in Parwich ........ which allows one to presume that Eliza might have been born in Parwich


sylvia

Hi Margaret

Eliza Webster's Father was William Webster born c1782 her Mother was Lucy nee Plant born c 1791.
Regards Ann

There's this Robert Dale marriage in 1840 but Eliza is a Smith:

Marriages Dec 1840 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

DALE Ann Margaret Ashborne 19 327
DALE Robert Ashborne 19 327
GOODALL John Ashborne 19 327
KENT Isaac Ashborne 19 327
SHAW Maria Ashborne 19 327
SMITH Eliza Ashborne 19 327

Do you know Eliza's father's name, Ann?
The one married to George Ford had father Thomas:

FORD, George Marriage
Wife: Eliza WEBSTER
Marriage Date: 21 Nov 1841 Recorded in: Allestree, Derbyshire, England
Collection: St Edmund
Husband's Father: Thomas FORD
Wife's Father: Thomas WEBSTER
Source: FHL Film 1041426 Dates: 1838 - 1841

Jen Yorkshire

I think Eliza Webster married Robert Dale in 1840 but there is some confusion as to wether this is right.Regards Ann

Sylvia I am new to this researching I have tried to do it through the website you suggested but to no avail I must be doing something wrong.Ann

any idea name of husband?
there is a couple poss abt the right yr?
Record
Eliza Webster George Lees 22 May 1837 Derby, Derbyshire, England
View Record
Eliza Webster George Ford 21 Nov 1841 Allestree,

Ann

you can do it yourself at www.freebmd.org.uk

it's free to use




sylvia

Thanks for your prompt reply.Maybe free bmd.rootsweb.com are you able to do it or can I.Regards Ann

Take your pick from here:

http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl

Rose

Could anyone look up a marriage certificate for Eliza Webster born approximatly 1812 and may have married 1840 in Derbyshire.
Hope you can help.Regards Ann