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Hello Janey

have taken your advice and subscribed to ancestry.com for trial

have made contacxt and will just wait know

thanks for your help again

regards

craig

Hi Craig

To go back further with "your" Amos you will need to find some way or someone who can check the Wraxall Somerset (which Amos gives as his place of birth) Parish Registers for his baptism to find the names of his parents,although according to the 1841 census his mother was probably an Elizabeth !

Thanks JC for refering me to this thread.

Only learnt of my connection to the Perring family recently, through a second marriage of my ancester Ann Pullen.

Ann married a Richard Perring, who I assume is Adelaide's brother.

I do not have very much info about Richards parents & siblings as he (they) are not actually part of my family.

However I have contacted the member who gave me my info and hopefully she may be able to help Craig .

Hello Elizabeth
I have liased with another member who had this iin there tree, unfortunately not the Amos i was looking for

thanks again

regards

Craig

I still don't know what you're saying about the Hillier spelling being changed.

The name was HILLIER in 1841, and the name of Amos's mother Elizabeth was HILLIER in 1851, and so on down. There has been no change of spelling.

You're quite welcome. I only hope that you won't be one of the men who think only the male line is important ... you wouldn't really be here without the female lines, would you now?

Adelaide Perring is certainly as much your and your father's ancestor as her husband was! In fact, when you think about it, your female ancestors are really the only ones you can be absolutely sure actually *are* your ancestors. ;)

I hope you'll contact the woman here at GR who has both these surnames in your tree, as she will likely be able to give you lots of information. Enjoy.

Hello Janey
thanks for all this information , my main focus is on the Hillier side and all this makes alot of sense as my father has said that he believed the name,s Hillier spelling could have been changed

this information i am receiving is mind blowing as i am new to this
but it is so good
thanks alot
regards
craig

Craig, is there any chance of you acknowledging and commenting on the rather huge amount of work I have done for you?


In the 1841 census that Elizabeth posted way back at the beginning, it isn't a matter of the surname being *changed*, the surname was *misread* by the people who transcribed it from the original image.

I've given you the information that someone related to the family - someone who is a member of this website here - has corrected the spelling to HILLIER, which is what it really was.

Hello Elizabeth

I did read some information of as per the above census,
this could be him as my father has thought that the surname could have been changednfor whatever reason.

Would also make some sense re difficulty to follow up
Dates do seem right

this might all come to fruitition
thanks so much
regards
craig

Julie hasn't read my PM yet ... I was hoping for some feedback from Craig ...

There are deaths in NSW that would match Adelaide's parents.

http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/cgi-bin/Index/IndexingOrder.cgi/search?event=births


2905/1866
PERRING PETER
father RICHARD
mother MARY
WENTWORTH

14118/1886
PERRING JANE
father JOHN
(no mother stated) DIED WENTWORTH
WENTWORTH


Possibly you have this, since you said you have info about the family in Australia?

If not, the death certificates should list all their children.


One Perring death with father Peter and mother Jane, matches son Richard in the 1841 census in Devon:

14083/1901
PERRING RICHARD
father PETER
mother JANE
LIVERPOOL

There's no marriage showing for him in NSW.

http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/cgi-bin/Index/IndexingOrder.cgi/search?event=marriages

But this is probably his child:

5703/1867 PERRING PETER J E - RICHARD, ANN - WENTWORTH


Peter, Adelaide's father, named his son Richard for his father.
Richard, Adelaide's brother, named his son Peter for his father.

The person who corrected the Hillier name at Ancestry is a member here at GR and has Peter Perring 1867 in her tree here at GR. I hope I haven't gone in a big circle of things you already know. Since you said you were looking for Adelaide's ancestors, I've assumed you didn't know her parents or siblings.


And here's the fun thing. One of the other people who has that Peter Perring in her tree is a familiar member here at GR. I'm going to send her a message to have a look at your thread!

And we say people never find relations through these threads. ;)

Marriages Jun 1848
HILLIAR Abraham Bedminster 11 99
> HILLIER Abraham Bedminster 11 99
HILLMAN Elizabeth Ann Bedminster 11 99
White James Bedminster 11 99


There's a bride missing. But that marriage certificate would give you the name of the father of Amos and Abraham.


Found them in 1851

Name: Abraham Hellier
Age: 32
Estimated birth year: abt 1819
Relation: Head
Spouse's name: Elizabeth Ann
Mother's Name: Elizabeth
Where born: Wraxall, Somerset, England

Civil parish: Wraxall
County/Island: Somerset

Abraham Hellier 32
Elizabeth Ann Hellier 31
Emly Ann Hellier 11 Mo
Elizabeth Hellier 79


If you search trees here at GR for HILLIER born in Wraxall (no other details needed), you'll find someone who has Emily Hillier and several younger people, undoubtedly Abraham's other children, in his tree. One is an Amos born 1863.

Three other people have Peter Perring, 1806, Totnes, in his tree.

You can send messages to all those people by clicking on the "Find out more" button beside their names when you do those tree searches.

There are 3 Amos Hillier births in NSW after 1845. The fathers are

1880 William Ephraim
1891 William
1892 Richard

No marriages before 1919 and no deaths for the name Amos Hillier before 1919. No births to Amos or Adelaide Hillier. So they must have gone to a different state.

One does wonder whether the later Amos Hilliers are related, particularly if your Amos's father was also Amos; other sons might have named children for him.


Well aha. At Ancestry, someone has corrected the family's surname.

Name: Amos Hellen
[Amos Hillier]
Age: 21
Estimated birth year: abt 1820
Where born: Somerset, England

Civil parish: Wraxall
County/Island: Somerset

Elizh Hellen 67
Aba Hellen 23 - corrected to Abraham Hillier
Amos Hellen 21


(the image says Ab'm) You can contact that user through the Ancestry system. If you don't subscribe, you can take out a 14-day free subscription and send her a message - be sure to include an email address in case it takes her longer than 2 weeks to reply. The correction was made 2 years ago, but she was active on the system yesterday. I have no idea why I didn't find this yesterday ...

She isn't necessarily a family member, but there's a good chance she is.

The Ancestry user says it has been "checked to later censuses". But I don't see Abraham in 1851. Elizabeth may be in Bedminster as a lodger.

(Tip for future - you edited your subject line and opening message, but unless you add a post to the thread, no one might see/notice the change.)

So this is certainly Adelaide's family in 1841 then, in Devon? (You didn't comment on what I posted.)

Peter Perring 35
Jane Perring 35
Adelaide Perring 9
Richard Perring 6
Mary Perring 8 Mo

Devon records can be difficult to access. The IGI has very incomplete parish records. (Devon parishes were particularly reluctant to give the Mormons access, as I understand it.)

http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/igi/search_igi.asp

It doesn't show any children for Peter Perring and Jane in Devon (the marriage I posted above).


The Devon Family History Society does have transcripts of parish records. They do not offer free access at their website, but you can do a surname search to see what they do have, and order a transcript.

http://www.devondb.co.uk/devonfhs/members-area/surnames-all.jsp

A basic broad search shows quite a few marriages and baptisms for the 1813-1837 period for Perring.

You can also post at the discussion board there

http://members.boardhost.com/devonfhs/

to see whether anyone has records (CD etc.) that would have info about that household.


Since it seems now you *are* looking for the couple's ancestors, as I said, the birth certificate of Adelaide's younger sister would give her mother's full name. She may be the Jane Coombe in the marriage I posted, but she may not be. Swimbridge and Totnes are not very close.

Craig

Could this be him ?

1841 census-Wraxall Somerset
? HELLER Elizabeth-67-Ag lab
HELLER A ? 23
HELLER Amos 21

(someone else might have more luck working out the middle name ! )

List of Assisted Passage Immigrants to New South Wales 1828-1896

Vessel-Sir John Seymour--Arrival date-14 May 1849

Amos HILLIER-27-Ag Lab-born Somersetshire-Read or write ?=Read-
Rel -? Episcipalian

Perhaps someone can help find his baptism-I tried FreeReg which has Wraxall listed but no luck

Hello Elizabeth

Around C1820

More than likely he was born in England

Thanks
Regards Craig

There are several people with an Amos Hillier in their tree born 1891 NSW Aus-are you looking for an earleir one born in England ?
If so do you have any idea when or where he was born ?

Hello
I am new to this so sorry for missing any information, i am trying to trace by fathers forebears if this is the right word.
ie my fathers grandparent , great grand parents etc.

All descendant prior to above reside in Australia
thanks
regards
craig

1841

Name: Adelaide Perring
Age: 9
Estimated birth year: abt 1832
Gender: Female
Where born: Devon, England

Civil parish: Totnes
County/Island: Devon

Peter Perring 35
Jane Perring 35
Adelaide Perring 9
Richard Perring 6
Mary Perring 8 Mo


Gotta be?

Can't find them in 51 or 61. Suspected Australia, NSW search thing isn't working.


Younger sister's birth certificate would give mother's full name:

Births Dec 1840
PERRING Mary Totnes 9 476

There's a marriage in the IGI of Peter Perring and Jane Coombe, 1829, Swimbridge, but that would be guessing.

Oh, oops, you said details prior to the couple *are* known, not are not known. ;)

Well in that case - you're apparently looking for descendants - you'd better give a location!!

And ... is he Mr Hillier, or Mr Amos?

No marriage in England/Wales, either way.