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I think any responsible adult can witness a marriage, or even an older child can,who understands what they are witnessing.

My father and OH's fathers were the witnesses at our marriage.

Gwyn

Thanks everyone - I followed replies until my 18mth old demanded attention !

I think i'll put the albert / charlotte family in my tree and see if i can weave any more evidence of connections. No doubt 1921 census will make useful reading ! I may try to see if Albert had a brother William (and were in same trade together) if he died soonish after birth may explain if Florence then lived with her uncle william.

Going back to my original post and the generic question.

Can a father be a witness at a marriage ??? I somehow thought not which would mean the William witness could be the brother noted in that family.

cheers
DJ

Florence may even have been born with a different surname but went on to adopt a stepfather's name.

Not all certificates are correct.
My grandparents married in 1900, but for ages I couldn't find it in the index.
Eventually I found grandmother's maiden name and searched using that and realised that her husband had been logged under only half of his surname and the certificate showed his father with the similar wrong surname.
Another marriage certificate within my tree shows the bride's father as Janet whereas it was James ( the bride was Janet, so I guess the vicar wasn't concentrating too well )

I understand your reluctance to accept that William could be Albert, but the very similar job description suggests this might be so.

Gwyn

Not sure if it's of any help, but posting for reference....
Name: Charlotte Louisa Preston
Age: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1879
Spouse Name: Albert Collier
Spouse Age: 25
Record Type: Marriage
Marriage Date: 01 Sep 1901
Parish: St Clement, Notting Hill
County: Middlesex
Borough: Kensington and Chelsea
Father Name: George Preston
Spouse Father Name: William Collier ( deceased, blacksmith )

Some more possible births for that 1911 family. Any of these names familiar?

Births Dec 1913 COLLIER John H Preston Fulham 1a 309
Births Mar 1915 Collier Leonard P Preston Fulham 1a 336
Births Sep 1916 Collier George H Preston Hammersmith 1a 282

An aunt of mine got mixed up with names when she married in Canada. She was a home child because her mum had died so went to Canada aged 10 .She put her brothers name as her dads name. they were similar but her memory must have been faulty because she hadnt seen her family since she was 10.

So I wouldn't take every certificate as the actual truth. Info on them are only as good as the informants knowledge at the time.

In your case the dads occupation is very similar and she has a brother william too

Is it possible that her father was deceased at the time of her marriage and had died when she was quite young and she assumed that her oldest brother William had been named for his father?

not that i can see
sorry

thanks all - those are the right people for that birth certificate but its the marriage certificate with her father as william that I have to treat as accurate.

But no william , as a builder/decorator, with a florence daughter anywhere !!? :-(

DJ

in the 1911 census above their is a brother William

COLLIER, Albert Head Married M 35 1876 House Painter London Kensington VIEW
COLLIER, Charlotte Wife Married
9 years F 32 1879 London Kensington VIEW
COLLIER, William Son M 4 1907 London Hammersmith VIEW
COLLIER, Florence Daughter F 2 1909 London Hammersmith VIEW
COLLIER, Charles Son M 0 (2 MONTHS) 1911 London Kensington VIEW
RG number:
RG14 Piece:
166 Reference:
RG14PN166 RG78PN6 RD2 SD3 ED2 SN382

Registration District:
Kensington Sub District:
Kensington North Enumeration District:
2 Parish:
Kensington

Address:
40 Blecheynden St N Kensington

charlottes marraige
Name: PRESTON, Charlotte Louisa
Registration District: Help Kensington
County: London
Year of Registration: 1901
Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Spouse's last name: Not available before 1912
Volume No: Help 1A
Page No: Help 412

Name: COLLIER, Albert
Registration District: Kensington
County: London
Year of Registration: 1901
Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Spouse's last name: Not available before 1912
Volume No: 1A
Page No: 412
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Albert 1901?

1901 England Census
about Albert Collier Name: Albert Collier
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1876
Relation: Head
Gender: Male
Where born: Kensington

Civil parish: Hammersmith
Ecclesiastical parish: St James
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Fulham
Sub-registration district: North Hammersmith (including Starch Green)
ED, institution, or vessel: 22
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 120
Piece: 43
Folio: 96
Page Number: 16
Household Members: Name Age
Albert Collier 25 Painter and Gasfitter

Andy

Charlotte Louisa nee Preston.

I have to treat marriage certificate as the accurate definite and the birth cert as 'wrong one'. Well until I believe an error on marriage cert or similar.
ta

J

this is the 1911 for the fulham birth you mention
i expect you already have it
COLLIER, Albert Head Married M 35 1876 House Painter London Kensington VIEW
COLLIER, Charlotte Wife Married
9 years F 32 1879 London Kensington VIEW
COLLIER, William Son M 4 1907 London Hammersmith VIEW
COLLIER, Florence Daughter F 2 1909 London Hammersmith VIEW
COLLIER, Charles Son M 0 (2 MONTHS) 1911 London Kensington VIEW
RG number:
RG14 Piece:
166 Reference:
RG14PN166 RG78PN6 RD2 SD3 ED2 SN382

Registration District:
Kensington Sub District:
Kensington North Enumeration District:
2 Parish:
Kensington

Address:
40 Blecheynden St N Kensington County:
London

So this is the birth certificate you have which states father Albert ? ?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Sep 1908
Collier Florence Alice - Fulham 1a 182


Who does it give as mother ?