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Ruth, no James is definitely a seperateentry in the IGI with only Eleanor given as mother so it could be that she wasn't married and the James Wheeler who is the father of the other children was a relative of some sort. I think it is a trip to the records centre for you. regards Hilary

Joseph and James can soon become confused if the original entry was written as Jas. Jos. which is frequently what you find in PRs.

Hi Pheonix you may well be right it wont of been the first in the family and it sure wont be the last. God yours sounds a bit complecated lol best wishes ruth

Hi Hilory thanks for that do you think that joseph could of called himself James. I know they had a habit of changing thier names all the time. Maybe when I found him on familysearch it was added at a later date best wishes ruth

In most instances you will be looking at a straightforward illegitimacy, but you really should try to get hold of the register to see what it says as you cannot assume that the mother was unmarried. Two examples from my family (names changed to protect the sensitive!) Ann, daughter of Mary Smith (her husband having been absent for 6 3/4 years) Elizabeth, daughter of Sarah Brown, by her husband's son. You might not wish to claim Sarah as your ancestor, but it does put a different perspective on the family.

Ruth, it might not be there is a Joseph Wheeler born 1805 ,Cleobury Mortimer parents John and Eleanor Wheeler By doing what Reggie suggested and clicking on batch number you get:- Jane Wheeler 6/8/1812 Sarah Wheeler mar 1810 Joseph Wheeler 24/3/1805 All Christening dates and all parents John And Eleanor BUT no James best wishes Hilary

Thanks Hilory thats her I know that her son was born there and most of the family so I guess thats her seems she was a naughty girl lol. best wishes ruth

Ruth, on the family search site there is an Eleanor Wheeler born in Cleobury Mortimer in 1786 so it's possible she was unmarried- you'd have to look at the actual Parsh Records I suspect. best wishes Hilary

Thanks very mush reg for your help and advice kind regards ruth

Joseph in 1841? Hannah Wheeler abt 1816 Shropshire, England Neen Savage Shropshire View Record Joseph Wheeler abt 1806 Shropshire, England Neen Savage Shropshire The marriage cert would resolve the query........ Reg

Thanks for that Nell it looks like a trek to Shrewsbury is on the horizon regards ruth

If you scroll down on the IGI till you see a batch number on the left side the page (prefix P), and click on that, you can enter the surname and mother's forename in the appopriate boxes, and discover two probable siblings and a father for at least one of them Reg

The entry you found has Eleanor in the father's name, so it might be that the father was called a similar name, - Eleazar perhaps. Or it could be that Eleanor was a widow or single mum. You could look at all the Wheeler baptisms in Cleobury Mortimer on the IGI and see if there are others with a parent named Eleanor. Otherwise you will have to check the entry you found in the original registers which should be in Shropshire Records office. You could also contact the relevant family history society as they often have transcripts and will do searches for a small sum. Or you could order the microfilm of the parish registers to see at your nearest LDS family history center. nell

Thanks very much, at least I know now regards ruth

If only the mother's name is given, it's 99% certain that she was unmarried. Had she been a widow, the father's name would have been known...........and recorded. Reg

Hi its shropshire ruth

I have a James Wheeler born Cleobury Mortimer in 1808 I am trying to see if he had brothers or sisters I found his birth on familysearch and it only has his mothers name (Eleanor) does this mean she was a widow or had him on her own? I would love to know if he had siblings or his fathers name. thanks for any help ruth