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Sorry I did not reply before had some problems....... First of all Von... Witnesses on marriage certificate are ERNEST LONGLEY, and LAVINA LOWRENCE So really no help there as for addresses there is only an address for the bride which is WHEATLEY LANE. DONCASTER. There is no address for James. Margaret that is what I thought it said by scholar but thought I must be wrong but that was all I could make out. I can't understand why a 9 year old was on her own in a house...... Christine

Thought I'd better explain my last response, Christine. I just had another 'senior moment', got my Lydia and Laura mixed up. You're correct Laura Lines was living all alone at the tender age of 9! There is something written beside her occupation of scholar. I can't make it out. It looks like 'scholar, if so learning vice'. Surely not! Margaret

Yes, I saw that Christine but didn't mention it, didn't want to confuse the issue further! That Laura wasn't alone, she just happened to be at the top of the page so they made her head. It must be the same Laura but mother was Mary Ann instead of Sarah Ann. And there were even more children!!! Margaret

Margaret I have just looked on 1861 census to see if I could find the family you found and guess what I found Laura Lines aged 9 living on her own.......... But I found on the same original image another family of Lines with Mary Ann Lines aged 31 Unmar Head with her children William aged 9, Lydia aged 7 and Sophia aged 5 all living 56 Pound? Lane Woodbridge. Laura lives at No 59 Christine

I thought you had something there Margaret. Its 1 step ahead and 4 back Christine

I have a theory, Christine, and boy, if you were confused before, you'll really be confused now! Presuming that the James born 1873, Woodbridge is the one we're looking for, I looked for other Lines born in Woodbridge. There were these: Laura 1852, George 1862, Charles 1864, Samuel 1872, Alice 1877, Elizabeth 1878. Now on the 1871 census there's a Sarah Lines, unmarried living with George Fish along with children Laura 17, George 8, Charles 6 and Alice 4.The children are all Lines. On Free BMD Sarah Ann Lines marries George Fish 1879. On the 1881 census the children are all Fishes. George 18, Charles 16, Alice 14, Samuel 9 and Elizabeth 3. OK so where's our James? I decided to look for James Fish. Dammitt! The trail just ran cold. I really thought I was on to something! I thought that James had been going by the name Fish but when he married he had to use his legal name. In 1891 Sarah A. Fish is a widow and living with her son Charles Lines. Back to the old drawing board? Margaret

You say in one of your post's that he may have been born in Diss, her is a possible birth, if he was born in Diss then the birth would be registered at District Depwade Name: James Lines Year of Registration: 1875 Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep District: Depwade County: Norfolk, Suffolk Volume: 4b Page: 219 Roy

Yes Margaret it is confusing... It seems everyone I am asked to help on is confusing...... The thing is James died in Sep Q 1953 and the age says 85 and it says this on his tombstone but my friend assures me this is wrong and that he was 80. Now taking the age on the marriage cetificate this is right he was only 80. I took the age difference on 1901 census to be within the bounds that we usually go to. It is a very difficult one. Christine

Although on the 1901 census, which is the only one that we can confirm is him, he gives his place of birth as Nk, Suffolk. (Nk being not known). His year of birth there is 1870. Margaret p.s. My it is a confusing one!

Their are only 2 possible births on freebmd for him in Norfolk and none are at Diss and none are 1873 Name: James Lines Year of Registration: 1875 Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep District: Depwade County: Norfolk, Suffolk Volume: 4b Page: 219 Name: James Samuel Lines Year of Registration: 1879 Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec District: Smallburgh County: Norfolk Volume: 4b Page: 55 Roy

I have been in touch with my friend and apparentley it is not confirmed James was from Suffolk. He always said he was from Diss in Norfolk and a family member went there and looked through records but found nothing. I have just found out that the Suffolk bit came from the person my friend paid to search but the person he found the Fathers name was William. Christine

Hate to shoot down your theory, Roy, but I had a look at the 71 census and the name is James P. Gross. Margaret

Thanks Roy Yes that is the birth I found and it might be the best way forward to get the certificate. I will suggest that to my friend. Christine

check this image out from the 1881 census, i am not convinced thai it is James P. Gross, and think it could be James Lyons but age is out by 4 yrs Name: James P. Gross Age: 12 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1869 Relation: Son Father's Name: Arthur S. Mother's Name: Catherine Gender: Male Where born: Woodbridge, Suffolk, England Civil Parish: Woodbridge County/Island: Suffolk Country: England Street address: Burkitt Rd 'The Lodge Education: Employment status: View Image Occupation: Scholar Registration district: Woodbridge Sub-registration district: Woodbridge And Wilford ED, institution, or vessel: 11 Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Frances L. Clarke 21 Sarah E. Cocksedge 27 Georgiana Fulcher 23 Arthur B. Gross 8 Arthur S. Gross 37 Catherine Gross 40 Charles F. Gross 11 Elsie M. Gross 2 Frank H. Gross 3 Gertrude E. Gross 6 James P. Gross 12 Katherine M. Gross 10 Eleanor M. Hails 22 Source Citation: Class: RG11; Piece: 1883; Folio: 31; Page: 24; Line: ; GSU roll: 1341455. Just found a birth for James P. Gross so 1881 must be correct her is your James birth, i think you realy need to buy the cert Name: James Lines Year of Registration: 1873 Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec District: Woodbridge County: Suffolk Volume: 4a Page: 645 Roy

Thanks Margaret yes I found his birth and death and yes the 1901 does say coal carter. Christine

Another difficult one! I'm looking but no luck yet. I presume you have this birth from Free BMD? James Lines, Dec, Q, 1873, Woodbridge (4a 645) Also on the 1901 census I read his occupation as coal carter and not miner. Carter is more in keeping with his occupation as drayman on the marriage certificate. Margaret

I am trying to help someone again who is stuck, they have even payed for searches and got nowhere. So hoping I can get some help. My friends Mother was Edith May Lines b.30/12/1905 in Wombwell Barnsley South Yorshire Her Father was James Lines b. 1873 Woodbridge Suffolk (this is the line we are searching) The whereabouts of birth is not comfirmed please read further down for my reply. James married Elizabeth Garforth Longley in Mar Q 1896 By the marriage certificate James was 22 years old Bachelor and a Drayman - Milkman. The surname on the certificate is spelt LYONS. The marriage took place at St Georges Church Doncaster. His Father on the certificate was Arthur Lyons a Labourer. The problem is we cannot find James and Arthur together on any census. on 1881 cannot find either of them. On 1891 there is a possible of James being a servent in the parish of St George Hanover Square Mayfair London. It just don't seem to add up. I found him on 1901 with his Wife living in Wombwell Barnsley and he was a Miner. Surname on this is spelt Lynes Even on his gravestone there has been a mistake, his age is put at 85 and he was 80 years old. Please can anyone make sense of any of this. Christine