Genealogy Chat

Hello, I'm having problems with one of my family lines .... my Grandad, John Baron, was 65 when he died in 1954 (making his year of birth 1888) - but on his marriage record in 1913 he is aged 20 (making his year of birth 1892). I'm not sure of his place of birth but I do know where he was brought up. His father's name was Thomas (marriage cert). I know some of his siblings names and have found a 1901 census record in the right area which matches all these names together; the age of the John Baron on this 1901 census is 10yrs (making his year of birth approx. 1890). I have contacted the school he attended but they only have partial records so that was a dead end. It's a bit frustrating because I have enough info to get started but can't proceed until I can confirm his d.o.b. or know his mother's name. HAS ANYONE ANY SUGGESTIONS PLEASE? Annette

This is the info you have: You have found John Baron 1901 census is 10yrs [dob 1890] John Baron aged 20 on his marriage record in 1913 [dob 1892]. Father's name on cert is Thomas. John Baron, was 65 when he died in 1954 [dob 1888] As John would need to be 21 to marry without his parents' consent, I don't see why he would lie about his age as 20 on his marriage cert. Death ages are notoriously incorrect, as they rely on the informant of the death - my own uncle got the year of his father's birth wrong on the death cert. I would suggest that you try to find Thomas the father and whichever siblings were around on the 1891 census and see whether or not John is on that. Where does it say he was born on 1901 census? nell

I am guessing, from your message, that you have a known month and date for his birthday, but it's the year that you are struggling with? If that is right, then you will probably know which quarter(s) of any given year his birth should have been registered - for instance, if you believe he celebrated his birthday on March 20th, then he should have been registered in Q1 or Q2, but not Q3 or Q4. Once you have restricted the number of possible birth regsitrations as far as possible, you could apply for each remaining cert asking for a checking point of his fathers name. if you are really brave, you could also ask for a checking point of his actual birthday, but you are risking the fact that he could have celebrated on the wrong day (like my father-in-law lol) Is he on the 1891 census (the age should be more accurate on that, perhaps?) Good Luck Sarah

Thanks to all who replied. Thats a good point about needing parent's consent to marry if under 21. It does seem unlikely that he would lie about being 20yrs when he married. The possible family match in the 1901 census cannot be found in the same area for the 1891 census. I am told by my family he was born in November (date a bit vague) and that he drew his pension in November 1953, just a few months before his death in May 1954, hence why everyone thought he was 65. His death was registered aged 65yrs. Just to throw another spanner in the works - there are 2 John Baron's registered in the poissible birth years (July 1892 and November 1888) at my local registrars - both with father's named Thomas! I will take your advice and take a closer look at the 1891 census. The 1901 census family's John Baron was born in Chowbent (an area in Atherton, Lancs) and his siblings were born in Holywell (Flintshire), Burnley (Lancs) and Croft (Warrington area I think) so this family moved around a bit! Anyway, thanks again! Annette

I would go with the 1888 date for his birth. On the 1891 census he is born 1889 so if he was born later 1892 he would not be there in 1891 would he? If he collected his pension he must have been 65 surely. Do you have to prove your age with a copy of your birth cert to collect the pension? Margaret

if this is the 1901 family you saw: Ann Baron abt 1895 Croft, Lancashire, England Daughter Wigan Lancashire Ellen Baron abt 1884 Holywell, Flintshire, Wales Daughter Wigan Lancashire Jane Baron abt 1861 Newcastle, Staffordshire, England Wife Wigan Lancashire John Baron abt 1891 Chowbent, Lancashire, England Son Wigan Lancashire Teresa Baron abt 1887 Burnley, Lancashire, England Daughter Wigan Lancashire Thomas Baron abt 1851 Wigan, Lancashire, England Head Wigan Lancashire Then this looks like the same family in 1891: Baron, Ellen abt 1882 Holywell, Flintshire, Wales Daughter Westleigh Lancashire Baron, Jane abt 1861 Holywell, Flintshire, Wales Wife Westleigh Lancashire Baron, John abt 1889 Atherton, Lancashire, England Son Westleigh Lancashire Baron, Teresa abt 1884 Burnley, Lancashire, England Daughter Westleigh Lancashire Baron, Thomas abt 1856 Wigan, Lancashire, England Head Westleigh Lancashire Baron, Thomas abt 1885 Leigh, Lancashire, England Son Westleigh Lancashire So John is aged 2 in 1891!!!! Nearly all of them vary in age by a few years! Note mother Jane now comes from Flintshire! Suggests she may have gone to her family for her first confinement? You would need to check up if it is the same wife on both census records. My hubby's ancestor was married to three different Ann's and two were even born in the same place at roughly the same time - these things are sent to try us lol Sarah

Thanks to Margaret and Sarah. I have a copy of the 1901 census and Jane Baron's place of birth did originally read as Wales but it has been crossed out and replaced with Newcastle, Staffs. Why didn't they stick with the same age?! One of my ancestors has a different age on each of the 3 census copies I have, I also have his birth, marriage & death certs and they don't match either! But that's another story. I will check to see if the John Baron born November 1888 had a mother named Jane - hopefully this will match. Thanks to everyone who replied. Annette