General Chat

Oh Wisechild what a lovely and true comment from your Gran .. Think On..
It´s what I am trying to do, I love life out here, even now when I am spiraled back into an ex-pat area, I love the country ..I even love the fact that you can´t get dole if you are an immigrant or housing and housing benefits I do worry that as a non speaker but a resident I may pay a tad more for health care, but that´s my choice., After 9 years the UK ould boot me out anyway!

Dermot keeping ya money in that biscuit tin is great but what happen if you have a fire ? I after all I did found another 20 quid in different currency in a sock last week. I could have given it away

Banks & some Bank Managers in the UK are currently receiving much bad press reports, as the Rev Paul Flowers could reluctantly testify - although I doubt if he can be trusted even tell the difference between the truth & a damn outright pack of lies.

Meanwhile, I'm keeping my 'fortune' in a biscuit tin under the bed. Safest place right now! And I'm not half as silly as I think I am either!

To be honest Uzzie, although we have lost a small fortune financially, we have a more peaceful lifestyle than I would have had if I had retired in the middle of Birmingham, where I was born & brought up & which I love to bits.
We have made lots of really good friends which can´t be measured financially & in many ways that has helped us to integrate, because we are all in the same boat.
Also, interestingly, it´s almost certain that what you can do effortlessly when you are 60, you almost certainly won´t be able to do at 70.
Think on, as my grandmother used to say.

Some very interesting comments here for me to think about.

Liz the 5bed house wouldn´t have been much good as holiday rental for the area that it is, plus as OH said we can get 2 x 1or2 bed for the price of that in the area of better rental potential either as holiday or long lets.....

Ah ah :-D :-D big smiley grins, OH didn´t wring my neck but actually has and is considering the options.
We need to buy close to us, and yes we are aware of all the extra taxes of Spain having just bought this place, but we think to buy close as that allows us to monitor and look after the property whether it goes on holiday lets, 6mths or 11mth rolling contracts. If we went for long lets only (11mth contracts) we probably could look further afield.
We also need to look at other options as to how the money could work for us. Spanish economy and Spanish banks are not an option, I may live here and not want to move but at this moment in time I don´t want my money tied up in a Spanish bank.
The property market here is at a low ebb with many offers so the idea is buy now ..tick over with hopefully some pin money for a few years and sell when and it would be when not if the market recovers. But then I could put it in a pension fund get a set amount each month but make no profit if I or my heir wants to cash in.

Dizzi I am sorry family of yours lost out in Bulgaria, it´s not easy buying abroad or for ex-pats who don´t always get told the system.

Rose I couldn´t and wouldn´t buy in the UK for many reasons although the thought has gone through my head as it would give a place back there should either of us need it when widowed :-\ but I hopefully won´t keep the property that long.

Wisechild
I am sorry that you are one of the many who has lost out. One of the considerations when we bought this house was how close it was to all that we would need as we got older (and for Mother dear rest her soul). I am sorry to say that is because of people like yourselves that I am looking at investing in cheap property. Even in Alcazares which still is a thriving tourist area so many apartments and 2nd homes are up for sale.

After saying all that the decision what to do with Mothers (rest her soul) money will not be gone into lightly.

Rollo
I find your comments very interesting, sadly I don´t have a million to spare or to let it hang around for a few years but myself and OH have often said if only, as what a killing you could make from the builders with the blocks they built and now can´t sell, so would let go at cost and even under. Your views on Spain´s economy are also interesting and OH was very interested to hear them.

Thank you to all for your comments and as said I still have my neck the right way round so that pleases me ;-)

OH HAS A RELATIVE IN BULGARIA,HE BOUGHT A SIX BED
BOARDING HOUSE FOR £45,000 SIX YEARS LATER HE'S
BACK HERE BOARDING HOUSE LOCKED UP.
LOCAL AND COUNTRY LAWS NOT THAT SIMPLE HE HAD TO EMPLOY
LOCALS ONLY TO WORK THERE ,CAME A CROPPER WHEN TRYING TO GET GUESTS UNDER PRICED ROOMS ENDED UP A BACKPACKERS HOSTEL
NOT MAKING ANY MONEY

We put our flat on the market in September 2007 for €170.000, We needed to move into town as the urbanisation where the flat is has no facilities or public transport from October to May & we are not getting any younger.
It has been reduced several times & is now at the level it was when we bought it, but very few viewings, let alone offers.
We usually manage to let it for the summer season, although not to tourists because of the tax implications. Now we are finding it almost impossible because there are so many properties for let by owners who can´t sell.
We are lucky to make enough from a let to cover the costs, let alone the maintenance, cleaning,etc.
I have some money in a sterling account with a Spanish bank on which I get about 1.5%. It was 5.3% when I opened the account.
The rest is in a euro a/c for a 3 year term on which I get about 2.1%, but at least I can access it if I need it, with the loss of interest.
With the exchange rate, cost of living,lower interest rates etc, we are about €30,000 worse off than we were 6 years ago & this can never be replaced as we are pensioners on a very low fixed income,
I know I don´t need to say this to you, but please weigh up your options very carefully before you make a move.
Having said that, we thought we had & had the rug pulled from under us.
Good luck Uzzie.

Well Uzzi, reading this through quickly, I would be wary of buying in UK because of the new tax rules being talked about.

I assume you are talking about letting out a property on a permanent or six month renewable contract rather than holiday lets.

If for holiday lets and/or longstay winter lets, I wonder if the bigger property to be renovated would be a good idea? What do you mean it's not a holiday let? Some people like to holiday together as it's the only time their families meet up if they live in different areas, and if that house is in a suitable area for holidaymakers and maybe has a pool or access to a pool, you would possibly make a good income from it and have a well appointed house to resell later on.

Hard choices to make, maybe you should sound T. out first lol

Lizxx

I used to have shares in Abbey National which brought in a bit of extra income, in dividends.

When Abbey was taken over by Santander, we were told that we would have to pay Spanish Corporation Tax on any dividends, on top of any tax deducted here!! :-| :-|

I sold my shares!!! :-)

There was an article in one of the papers about taxation for residents in Spain who had a property in the UK.

Although it was aimed at people who live part of the year in each country, it was a double whamy taxation wise. It implied that they would be taxed on the rental income earned in the UK AND by the Spanish.

If you were considering purchasing outside Spain, look carefully at the tax situation.

You have correctly sussed out that the time to make a buck is when an industry / region etc is well on its back, either through buying at the bottom or buying to break out the assets.

The downside is that the big boys and vulture funds tend to buy up debt and assets ( such as property ) and small punters can get badly burned.

Right now Spanish property deals are going on involving whole blocks of apartments on the coast, hotels, shopping malls and so on. The Spanish banking system is doing its utmost not to crystallise these losses which it is hoping to pass on to Germany through "debt mutualisation". Frau Merkel will have none of it but if she doesn't then she could be burned even worse...

Anyway studio flats from the airport southwards can be bought wholesale for as little as €10K single and €15K ... which means that a punter buying for € 30 K could lose 50% of his investment!

So what to do?

Well if you can play the game with a few million in the kitty why not ?
Otherwise sit tight keep your liquidity ( ideally not in Spain ) and wait.

The existing setup in Spain is simply not stable. Something will break big time and then is the time to jump in and use leverage to buy, say, 10 1 bed appts. all at a go. But not now and def. not under Rajoy who is either an imbecile or extremely economical with the truth.

Spain cannot export its way out of recession with the €uro as it is because it has to deal with internal deflation at the same time.

An overvalued currency sinks all boats.

¡Buena suerte!

Uzzi I don't know much about the Spanish property market, except that you need to be very careful, in terms both of what you spend and what it wll cost you in taxes on income from it, which may be different to here?

But if we were talking UK I would say definitely that money in property, providing you choose very carefully, cost and location wise, is better than putting money in the bank. Provided you are realistic in determining how much return you will get annually on rental after taxes and costs, so that the 'profit' is going to be worth the effort and also being realistic in what you could expect to sell it for in the future,and not relying on any great rise in the selling price.

Interesting Rollo as it would have been the Murcia region as my 1st choice to buy as I live here and see the really cheap property. The places I am seeing are on the coast and can earn an interest in holiday lets.

Incidentally Santandar is the last bank I would put money in...but an euro account in the UK could be good.

So I take it you are a 1 point for my being mad :-) :-)

The €uro crisis is not over and Spanish secondary banking far from out of danger. A Greek style depositor haircut remains a distinct possibility. You can easily open a €uro acccount in London.

This is def. not the time to buy property in Spain - another lurch downwards is quite possible. I have seen new build 1 bed flats in Murcia going for around € 20K cash on the nail. Several provinces are on the brink of going bust - Andalucia, Murcia, Catalonia.

Of course the head of Santandar has recently announced that everything in the garden is rosy but then he would wouldn't he?

My bank last week contacted me to offer me a deal because I have money sitting in there. Nice of them and I liked the deal but it means me tying money up for 3 years.
As I have more money to come when probate clears I am reluctant to tie money into a Spanish bank (bad interest rates) but this is the mad bit.

I am house hunting again :-S, The way property prices are around here I could pick up a cheap property and rent, then when the market picks up sell.
Yes I am thinking of a property to let, but unlike what I would want to live in I am looking at properties under 50,000 (well under) .....I have (naughty of me) found a 5bed 3 bath house that needs renovating for €70,000 but it isn´t a holiday let.
But I can find apartments for under €40,000 and 1 beds for under €30,000.

My Dad said you can´t go wrong in bricks and mortar, but I know you can if ou buy wrong and can´t wait to reclaim. The market is rock bottom now and about to turn. NOW is the time to buy out here.rent for awhile and then sell. I will have to check Spanish rules ..but do I have to buy in Spain ?
I must be mad ..hubby will wring my neck :-D