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hi
I am looking for information on Charles Colwell Avery, my Grandfather, born in Exeter in 1874, but he was never registered. His Mother Mary Ann Avery was not married when she had him and I have been told she was in Service. Mary Ann was born in South Molton, Devon. My grandfather had a family in Portsmouth with his 1st wife Florence before he married my Grandmother in 1916 in Sunderland.

can anyone please help as I have hit a brick wall on Charles and Mary Ann, who's father was William a farmer, born around 1837/8, but there are 2 possibilities for her
thanks

Lyn

Household:1881

John LOCKYER Head M Male 43 Woodbury, Devon, England General Lab
Mary A. LOCKYER Wife M Female 41 South Molton, Devon, England
Samuel W. LOCKYER Son U Male 18 Woodbury, Devon, England General Lab
Charles AVERY Stepson Male 7 Exeter, Devon, England


Dwelling 47 Bow St
Census Place Portsea, Hampshire, England

it would help connsiderably if you would reproduce the information you have, like census reports, say for the two posibilities for Mary Ann, since we really don't know what you're talking about when you say that.

no need for us to go hunting for information that you have !

how do you know Mary Ann's father was William a farmer, did she marry and that is on the certificate?

edit
well, Mike answered that question ...... but it shouldn't have been a question .....

Charles' first marriage ???
Marriages Mar 1893 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

>>>>>Avery Charles Colwell Portsea 2b 542
Edwards William Henry Portsea 2b 542
>>>>>Pullen Florence Rebecca Portsea 2b 542
Rogers Elizabeth Jane Portsea 2b 542

I presume Mary's father was named on this certificate ?

I assume therefore you have this but Chrissiex is right, we need the info for reference.

Marriages Jun 1878 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

*********Avery Mary Ann - Exeter 5b 170
DAVERIDGE Mary Elizabeth Exeter 5b 170
*********LOCKYER John - Exeter 5b 170
MORRISH John Exeter 5b 170

Charles Avery

England and Wales Census, 1881
birth: 1874 — Exeter, Devon, England
residence: Portsea, Hampshire, England

record title: England and Wales Census, 1881
name: Charles Avery
age: 7
gender: Male
birth year: 1874
birthplace: Exeter, Devon, England
relationship to head of household: Stepson
address: 47 Bow St
census place: Portsea, Hampshire, England
record type: Household
family history library film: 1341283
the national archives reference: RG11
piece / folio: 1155 / 24
page number:

When you say Charles' birth was never registered, how do you know that ?

Any idea where the name Colwell came from ?

Mary Ann Avery

England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
birth: 02 Nov 1816
residence: Devon, England
parents: William Avery, Hannah

record title: England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
name: Mary Ann Avery
gender: Female
baptism/christening date: 17 Nov 1816
baptism/christening place: INDEPENDENT,SOUTH MOLTON,DEVON,ENGLAND
birth date: 02 Nov 1816
father's name: William Avery
mother's name: Hannah
indexing project (batch) number: C06394-1
system origin: England-ODM
source film number: 590695

Mary Avery

England and Wales Census, 1861
birth: South Molton, Devon

record title: England and Wales Census, 1861
name: Mary Avery
age: 62
gender: Female
birthplace: South Molton, Devon
relationship to head of household: Head
record type:

Mary Avery

England and Wales Census, 1881
birth: 1863 — S Molton, Devon, England
residence: South Molton, Devon, England

record title: England and Wales Census, 1881
name: Mary Avery
age: 18
gender: Female
birth year: 1863
birthplace: S Molton, Devon, England
relationship to head of household: Serv
marital condition: Unknown
profession / occupation: General Serv Domest
address: 8 Alexandra Terr
census place: South Molton, Devon, England
record type: Household
family history library film: 1341540
the national archives reference: RG11
piece / folio: 2241 / 41
page number: 16

Ann of green gables ........ again ........ that is exactly the information Mike posted in the first reply ....... (please don't post the individual records for each household member now)


Mike ....... I would bet money that Colwell was the father's surname, that was a common practice, for children of unmarried parents

Mary's birth cert

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Dec 1838 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Avery Mary Ann - Southmolton 10 180

are these the two possibles, in 1851?

If the info on her marriage certificate is true, only one matches


William Avery 50 thatcher
Ann Avery 50
William Avery 16
Mary Ann Avery 14
Harriet Avery 11

in South Moulton, born in South Moulton


William Avery 56 >>>>> farmer of 70? acres
William Avery 25
Charles Avery 23
Mary Avery 14
Ann Muxworthy 49
John Saunders 21
John Man 14

in North Molton, born in North Molton


Mary Ann may have adjusted her age slightly when she married


Mike are you sure, lol? that is the birth certificate for _one of_ the Marys

Ann of green gables ...... please ...... won't you reconsider all this cutting and pasting .....


Unless there is some reason to think that a Mary Avery in the 1881 census who was born in 1863 has something to do with this question ..... oh no, let alone one born in 1816 ..... won't you delete all that?

__ See Mike's first post __ that is the family in question.

the question is about a particular Mary Ann Avery, not any old Mary Ann Avery who might turn up.

even though Lyn could have saved much of this confusion just by giving that information to start

So Mike I have looked for men named Colwell in Mary Ann's vicinity who would be good candidates, do you see anyone?

The thought did cross my mind which is why I asked the question ( would have been nice if Lyn could have stuck around to provide feedback)

Couple of Colwell births but not Charles .

The Birth for Mary Ann is the only one registered in Southmolton - which she gives as her birthplace in 1881 census.

that's true that it's the only birth registered, but South Molton is the registration district, the Mary whose father is a farmer in 1851 is in North Molton which is in South Molton registration district, if that isn't too muddled, lol.

hi

thank you so much for all your replies

I have the marriage certificate of Mary Ann Avery Spinster to John Lockyer, CharlesColwell Avery her son was 4 or 5. Mary Ann's father is listed as a Farmer deceased. So the 2 choices above, the Thatcher and Farmer are the 2 choices I have. I have checked the death lists and unfornuately both William Averys had deceased by her marriage. As families tended to keep names in the family I thought it could be the farmer as she has a brother Charles. I was told by my Dad's only living brother that Colwell was Charles Father's name and Mary Ann was in service and got pregnant to the head of the household. Charles was not registered and when he died they could find no record of his birth in Exeter, but as my uncle was young then he cant remeber too much about this.

Mary Ann Avery is listed as being born in South Molton and born probably around 1837/38 the 2 I know about are 4 on the 1841 census. I know its not the Kings Nympton, South Molton, Mary Ann born 1838 as I have been to Kings Nympton in Devon to follow that lead and it was not her.

the marriage June 1878 is correct to John Lockyer, then they moved to Portsmouth.

Mary Ann was widowed and married William Bass and she died Mary Ann Bass in 1915.

my grandfather Charles married Florence Pullen, she died in September 1916, yet he married my Grandmother Elizabeth Snowball in July 1916, 3 months before his wife died, and he was present at her death. He put his youngest children in a home in Portsmouth and when my grandmother found out she went and got them and brought them to Liverpool to live with them. A bigamist in the family.

It is my great grandmother Mary Ann I have been fascinated with as I cannot find her on the 1861 or 1871 census, if she was in service she may not have been listed