Genealogy Chat

I have the location of my gt grandfather's burial plot and would like to put something there but I apparently need to locate the owners of this plot to obtain permission or get them to transfer ownership to myself.

How do I go about finding out who owns this plot?

All advice greatly appreciated.

Is the burial plot in a cemetery? If so the cemetery office or the local council should be able to tell you who owns the plot.

Kath. x

We had this recently as we wanted to bury the ashes of our brother in the grandparents grave

I rang the parks and cemeteries dept of the local council and was able to say when the grandparents died and their records showed that grave ownership was grans eldest daughter

Sadly she died in 2008 aged 102 so no way of her signing consent or me taking over ownership of the grave .they sent me the pack for transfer but it's too complicated as it wants info I don't have and I am not her next of kin.Was going to cost too but would have paid to full fill brothers wish

Dependent on when the plot was first opened (ie first burial if more than one person in the grave) ownership may have reverted to the local council.

I located my ggp's grave. On visiting the cemetery office I was informed that it was a 4-person grave, and that the rights had expired. Thus the council could offer the two unused places to others.

I also enquired about a great uncle. Yes, he and his wife were also in a 4-person grave in the cemetery. The rights to that grave had also expired - and two other folk (not my rellies) had recently been buried there.

Horror!

So I bought the rights to my ggp's grave, which last for 25 years.

Thanks for your replies, I am sort of in a catch22 situation as far as I can see as the cemetery cannot give me the ownership info due to data protection. Which to me is a bit bizarre as the burial was nearly 100 years ago. But I will try the council and see if I possibly have enough info for the transfer pack.

I only know about the t's&c's of two councils. The one where my ggp's are buried and another where other rellies are buried. The latter has the same ownership procedures - that there is a finite enddate to ownership of the rights of burial.

Remember:- If the grave is on council, etc. ground the most likely scenario is that
someone might own the rights - they never own the plot.

You have stated "apparently" and "as far as I can see". Have you actually asked whether or not a private individual owns the rights?

Also. "would like to put something there ". Does "located" mean that you have visited the grave? And that there is no headstone, etc. in place? Lack of headstone would not surprise me. My ggp's grave was just grass. As were many plots around it. The very helpful cemetery staff told me that any monuments that were not in a good state were removed (health & safety issues).

But putting something there is another matter. Your council/cemetery probably have strict guidelines about what form "something" has to take.

You could ask the council to get in touch with the "owners" of the grave and to pass on your contact details to them stating that you are a member of the family. We did this with my husband's great grandfather's grave and this led to us meeting up with extended family that we had not known of before.

In this case there is no issue with data protection - although I doubt very much whether there really is anything in the data protection act that would stop you having this information anyway. Most companies and organizations quote the data protection act when what they really mean is that it is not their own policy to give out information.

As Inky1 says you usually buy the rights to a plot for a set number of years - usually 25 or 50 - and after that, if another fee is not paid, then ownership passes back to the council.

Kath. x

Not the two councils I have mentioned, but gives you a good idea of what it does cost. Especially if you are not a local resident........

http://www.royalgreenwich.gov.uk/info/331/funeral_-_cost_information/1147/fees_for_grave_plots_and_burials

That is interesting Inky1. Much more expensive than I would have expected.

We purchased the rights to a cremated remains plot for my dad in 1977 at a cost of £25 and renewed 25 years later for about £50 (not absolutely sure of the renewal amount as my sister paid it). This is in the north east so perhaps it's cheaper up here but just goes to show how the cost has spiralled.

Kath. x

Compare the price of properties in the North East & The Royal Borough of Greenwich. Is there a similar difference?

"Buy land, they are not making it any more!"
[Mark Twain]

I too find those fees very high. I paid nothing like that.

I just looked at house prices in Greenwich and similar properties seem to be 4 or 5 times more expensive than they are up here - with smaller gardens.

Apologies to Ashleaze for hijacking this thread and taking it off at a tangent.

Kath. x

My mum was buried in her dads grave in 2006 A grave for four people.
Her Dad died in 1943
A baby was buried in the same grave in 1946 (family)
Up to my mum being buried there had never been a headstone on the grave.
So it had not been touched in 60 years but there was no problem with ownership of the grave when Mum died.
Sadly Dad joined them last month.

Rights to a burial plot form part of one's estate, so tracking down descendants who are likely to have inherited may be the way forward.

Don't forget that if someone dies intestate, then there is a natural order of beneficiaries. This might mean that the rights could pass right out of the family.
eg.
If a widow with children married a widower and he then dies without a Will, the 2nd wife and in turn HER children would inherit burial rights.
This happened to a friend of mine just a few years ago and she had to track down the children of her stepmother, so that my friend could bury her brother in their own mother's grave.

Gwyn