Genealogy Chat

Thomas Daniel Chapman's occupation in 1881 ............ Clerk


NOTE:- there is another Thomas Chapman with wife Eliza around between about 1880-1900. This one is a Labourer.

CHAPMAN, THOMAS DANIEL BRIGHTY
GRO Reference: 1884 M Quarter in CROYDON Volume 02A Page 240



This family really does changes the ages around!!

safc ............

I'd beaten you to that 1901 census :-)

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Albert Cottage, 4, Park Place, Clapham, Wandsworth, London, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
John Brightley Head Married Male 47 1854 Furniture Salesman Hockering, Norfolk, England
Transcription
Hannah Brightley Wife Married Female 47 1854 - Wisbech, Cambridgeshire, England
Transcription
John Brightley Son Single Male 23 1878 Boot Shop Manager Hockering, Norfolk, England
Transcription
Eliza Chapman Sister Married Female 49 1852 - Hockering, Norfolk, England
Transcription
Daniel Chapman Son Single Male 17 1884 Mechanical Dentist Penge, Surrey, England
Transcription
Alfred John Webb Lodger Single Male 47 1854 Harness Maker Assistant Soho, Middlesex, England

???????????????? possible for Eliza Chapman, Thomas' wife

The image shows NURSE, not niece!!

1891 Census

Name: Eliza Chapman
Age: 40
Estimated birth year: abt 1851
Relation: Niece
Gender: Female
Where born: Denver, Norfolk, England
Civil Parish: Outwell
Ecclesiastical parish: Outwell
Town: Outwell
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England

Registration district: Wisbech
ED, institution, or vessel: 2

James Greer 32
Mary Ann Greer 27
Sidney Greer 5
Kitty Greer 4
Lilly Greer 3
Beatrice Greer 1
Victor Greer 1
Jane Edwards 46
Eliza Chapman 40 Married, Monthly Nurse


and in 1901, this does look like her!

1901 Census

Name: Eliza Chapman
Age: 49
Estimated birth year: abt 1852
Relation to Head: Sister
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Hockering, Norfolk, England
Civil Parish: Clapham
Search Photos: Search for 'Clapham' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
Ecclesiastical parish: St James
County/Island: London
Country: England

Registration district: Wandsworth
Sub-registration district: Clapham

John Brightly 47
Hannah Brightly 47
John Brightly 23
Eliza Chapman 49 Married,
Daniel Chapman 19 b.ca 1882, Penge, Surrey (I can't read his occupation)
Alfred John Webb 47

????


1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
47, Clarendon Street, Paddington, London, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Thomas Chapman Head Married Male 43 1858 General Labourer Harrow on the Hill, Middlesex, England
Transcription
Elizar Chapman Wife - Female 45 1856 Laundress Edgware, Middlesex, England

England Marriages 1538-1973 Transcription
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First name(s) Daniel
Last name Chapman
Name note -
Marriage year 1857
Marriage date 07 Jul 1857
Marriage place Marylebone
Father's first name(s) James
Father's last name Chapman
Spouse's first name(s) Rosa Oxley
Spouse's last name Clements
Spouse's father's first name(s) Thomas Oxley
Spouse's father's last name Clements
Residence Marylebone, Middlesex, England
County Durham
Country England
Record set England Marriages 1538-1973
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Subcategory Marriages & divorces
Collections from Great Britain

Index (c) IRI. Used by permission of FamilySearch Intl

safc .............


that looks good!

Charlotte must be ..........

CHAPMAN, ELIZA CHARLOTTE CLEMENTS
GRO Reference: 1876 D Quarter in CAMBERWELL Volume 01D Page 731

????


1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
(Cambridge House), 165, Fentiman Road, Lambeth, London, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Rose Chapman Head Widow Female 70 1831 - London, England
Transcription
Charlotte Chapman Daughter Single Female 23 1878 - Camberwell, Surrey, England
Transcription
Edith B A Ker Boarder Single Female 27 1874 Drapers Assistant Kings Cross, Middlesex, England

for my own satisfaction . Is this Rosa in 1891?

1891 Census

Name: Rose Chaman
[Rose Chapman]
Age: 60
Estimated birth year: abt 1831
Relation: Head
Gender: Female
Where born: Lambeth
Civil Parish: Lambeth
Ecclesiastical parish: South Lambeth St Ann
County/Island: London
Country: England

Registration district: Lambeth
Sub registration district: Kennington First

Rose Chaman 60 Widow, Annuitant
Rose Chaman 26 b.ca 1865, Overton, Hampshire
Nellie Chaman 18 b.ca 1873, Rowland Castle, Hampshire
Eliza Chaman 16 b.ca 1875, Camberwell, London
Charlotte Chaman 64 b.ca 1827, Canterbury, Kent, Sister
Edith H Gorringe 24 Visitor
Alfred W Gorringe 29 Visitor






??? Rosa's death

CHAPMAN, ROSA 75
GRO Reference: 1907 S Quarter in CAMBERWELL Volume 01D Page 382


If so, she should be in the 1901 Census



(Keith ........... in case you're wondering, I'm trying to see if she might be living with Thomas and Eliza :-) )

Is this Joseph, b. Hampshire ca.1872???

CHAPMAN, HENRY JOSHEPH CLEMENTS
GRO Reference: 1869 S Quarter in CATHERINGTON Volume 02C Page 126

Catherington was the Registration District shown on the 1871 Census when Daniel was a Station Master

and "Nellie" must be this one??

CHAPMAN, ELLEN CLEMENTS
GRO Reference: 1872 D Quarter in CATHERINGTON Volume 02C Page 130

???? Daniel's death

CHAPMAN, DANIEL 51
GRO Reference: 1885 M Quarter in LAMBETH Volume 01D Page 306

???

Deaths Mar 1884 (>99%)
Chapman Thomas 0 Croydon 2a 177

AG ..............

that looks good.

I had suspected that Margaret was Harry's mother.

????? child of TDOC and Eliza Brighty????

CHAPMAN, THOMAS DANIEL BRIGHTY
GRO Reference: 1884 M Quarter in CROYDON Volume 02A Page 240


There seem to be no other births registered

Harry's parents? If he was born illegitimately and given Littleboy as his middle name?

Marriages Dec 1862 (>99%)
Brightey Margaret Henstead 4b 479
Littleboy George Henstead 4b 479



Margaret Littleboy
in the 1871 England Census
Name: Margaret Littleboy
Age: 36
Estimated birth year: abt 1835
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: George Littleboy
Gender: Female
Where born: Hockering, Norfolk, England
Civil Parish: Norwich
Ecclesiastical parish: Norwich
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England
Registration district: Norwich
Sub-registration district: Conisford
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Household schedule number: 41
Piece: 1814
Folio: 25
Page Number: 7
Household Members:
Name Age
George Littleboy 34
Margaret Littleboy 36
George Littleboy 6
Clara Littleboy 4
Alice Littleboy 2



Margaret Littleboy
in the 1881 England Census
Name: Margaret Littleboy
Age: 47
Estimated birth year: abt 1834
Relationship to Head: Wife
Spouse: George Littleboy
Gender: Female
Where born: Hockering, Norfolk, England
Civil Parish: Norwich St Julian
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England
Street address: William Street No 7
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Dressmaker
Registration district: Norwich
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1943
Folio: 96
Page Number: 25
Household Members:
Name Age
George Littleboy 43
Margaret Littleboy 47
Clara Littleboy 14
Alice Littleboy 12
Ellen Littleboy 8
Eliza Littleboy 6



Margaret Littleboy
in the 1891 England Census
Name: Margaret Littleboy
Age: 57
Estimated birth year: abt 1834
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: George Littleboy
Gender: Female
Where born: Hockering, Norfolk, England
Civil Parish: Norwich
Ecclesiastical parish: St Julian
Town: Norwich
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England
Street address:
Registration district: Norwich
Sub registration district: Conisford
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1524
Folio: 47
Page Number: 25
Household Members:
Name Age
George Littleboy 53
Margaret Littleboy 57
Clara Littleboy 24
Alice Littleboy 22
Nellie Littleboy 18
Eliza Littleboy 13


Margaret Littleboy
in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1837-1915
Name: Margaret Littleboy
Estimated birth year: abt 1834
Registration Year: 1900
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 66
Registration district: Norwich
Inferred County: Norfolk
Volume: 4b
Page: 135


Not that that helps in any way with the original query about Eliza!

A G.....

I did notice that Harry was John's grandson .............. and forgot!! And that of course is the reaosn why there is no mmn showing in the GRO Index.

DOH!


The GRO Index shows Eliza and Clara with different mmn

Eliza as Ramm, and Clara as Rawlin

Harry Brighty
in the 1861 England Census
Name: Harry Brighty
Age: 2/12
Estimated birth year: 1861
Relation: Grandson
Gender: Male
Where born: Hockering, Norfolk, England
Civil Parish: Hockering
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England
Registration district: Mitford
Sub-registration district: Mattishall
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 51
Piece: 1240
Folio: 114
Page Number: 9
Household Members:
Name Age
John Brighty 50
Elizabeth Brighty 48
Margaret Brighty 27
Robert Brighty 23
Clara Brighty 13
Eliza Brighty 10
John Brighty 7
Harry Brighty 2/12

This looks like the Brighty family in 1851

1851 Census

Name: John Brighty
Age: 38
Estimated birth year: abt 1813
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Elizabeth Brighty
Gender: Male
Where born: Hockering, Norfolk, England
Civil Parish: Hockering
Ecclesiastical parish: Mitford
Phillimore Ecclesiastical Parish Maps:
View related Ecclesiastical Parish
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England

Registration district: Mitford
Sub-registration district: Shipdham

John Brighty 38 b.ca 1813, Hockering, Machineman
Elizabeth Brighty 39 b.ca 1812, Hockering
Margaret Brighty 19 b.ca 1832, Hockering
James Brighty 15 b.ca 1836
Robert Brighty 13 b.ca 1838
Elizabeth Brighty 8 b.ca 1843
Clara Brighty 3
Eliga Brighty 7 Mo
Suey Ramm 70 b.ca 1781, Foulsham, Norfolk, Mother-in-Law <<< name corrected to Lucy

Address:- Street



I think John Brighty has been "married" at least 3 times ...........

The children (James, Robert and Elizabeth) born after July 1 1837 are on the new Index as having no mmn, but there is a marriage for John Brighty to Elizabeth Brighty on Freereg2 but that takes place in 1834, after the birth of Margaret.

One of the times to be careful of the "no mmn means illegitimate" is when people with the same surname marry. I have it in my father's ancestors who lived in 3 small villages in Buckinghamshire, and cousin married cousin. The new Index appears to be taking same surname for baby and mother to mean illegitimate, but it is not always accurate.

BRIGHTY, ROBERT -
GRO Reference: 1838 M Quarter in OF THE MITFORD AND LAUNDITCH UNION Volume 13 Page 217

BRIGHTY, ELIZABETH - Order
GRO Reference: 1843 M Quarter in MITFORD AND LAUNDITCH UNION Volume 13 Page 244

Then we have the following ...........

BRIGHTY, CLARA RAWLIN
GRO Reference: 1848 M Quarter in MITFORD AND LAUNDITCH UNION Volume 13 Page 232

BRIGHTY, ELIZA RAMM
GRO Reference: 1850 S Quarter in MITFORD AND LAUNDITCH Volume 13 Page 229

PLUS ............

BRIGHTY, JOHN RAMM
GRO Reference: 1853 S Quarter in MITFORD AND LAUNDITCH Volume 04B Page 236



I'm digging!


as for not finding Thomas and Eliza after 1881 ....... could they have emigrated???????????

Eliza Brighty
in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Eliza Brighty
Gender: Female
Baptism Date: 10 Nov 1850
Baptism Place: Hockering, Norfolk, England
Father: John Brighty
Mother: Elizabeth Ramon
FHL Film Number: 1526670
Reference ID: p 63



Clara Brighty
in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Clara Brighty
Gender: Female
Baptism Date: 30 Apr 1848
Baptism Place: Hockering, Norfolk, England
Father: John Brighty
Mother: Elizabeth
FHL Film Number: 1526670
Reference ID: p 58


Harry is listed as John's grandson in the 1871 census