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Hi, on a previous thread (James Chamberlain born Ipswich 1871) I had some great help, but now I'm puzzled again. Could anyone look up 1841 census records nos H0107/1043/4 & HO107/1043/15 and enlighten me as to whether these two people are one and the same. If not, then the entry with a Robert Chamberlain (my namesake) is the one I want, in which case I need to establish all the facts I can, including maiden name of Mary Ann if possible. I'm afraid I may be mixing and merging facts as I seem to have done for the later James. Sorry to be a nuisance, but I'm at yet another crucial stage in my search.

1841 England Census
about Mary Chamberlain
Name: Mary Chamberlain
Age: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1806
Gender: Female
Where born: Suffolk, England

Civil Parish: St Nicholas
Hundred: Ipswich
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation: View Image

Registration district: Ipswich
Sub-registration district: St Matthew
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Ann Chamberlain 9
James Chamberlain 35
James Chamberlain 7
Mary Chamberlain 35
Susannah Chamberlain 11
Thomas Chamberlain 1
Walter Chamberlain 5

Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece 1043; Book: 15; Civil Parish: St Nicholas; County: Suffolk; Enumeration District: 12; Folio: ; Page: 3; Line: 19; GSU roll: 474646.

1841 England Census
about Robe Chamberlain
Name: Robe Chamberlain
Age: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1806
Gender: Male
Where born: Suffolk, England

Civil Parish: St Clement
Hundred: Ipswich
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation: View Image

Registration district: Ipswich
Sub-registration district: St Clement
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Maria Chamberlain 35
Maria Chamberlain 7
Robe Chamberlain 35

Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece 1043; Book: 4; Civil Parish: St Clement; County: Suffolk; Enumeration District: 10; Folio: 47; Page: 10; Line: 18; GSU roll: 474646

Hi Chrisa, I have this 1851 record which someone kindly led me to:
1851 England Census
about Robert Chamberlin
Name: Robert Chamberlin
Age: 13
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1838
Relation: Son
Father's Name: James
Mother's Name: Mary Ann
Gender: Male
Where born: St Clement, Suffolk, England

Civil Parish: Ipswich St Mary Stoke
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image

Registration district: Ipswich
Sub-registration district: St Matthedw
ED, institution, or vessel: 1c
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 32
Household Members: Name Age
Alfred Chamberlin 10
Eliza Chamberlin 7
Emily Chamberlin 17
James Chamberlin 48
Mary Ann Chamberlin 45
Robert Chamberlin 13
William Chamberlin 1

This all seems to tie in - there is an 1841 census showing much the same household. But yet another (searched under ChamberLIN) shows a James and Mary A about the same age but with different children which is the one you posted. The name on all the actual records mentioned clearly reads ChamberLAIN. The occupation of one James is a carpenter, but I can't read the occupation on the other record.
I'm sure these have to be two different people but my dilemna is in confusing two possible different sets of families....

Hi Robert
I think this is the right family. The image reads Chamberlain, James' occupation is carpenter and some children match up with the 1851 census.
Moggie

1841 England Census
about James Chamberland
Name: James Chamberland
Age: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1806
Gender: Male
Where born: Suffolk, England

Civil Parish: St Clement
Hundred: Ipswich
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation: View Image

Registration district: Ipswich
Sub-registration district: St Clement
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Alfred Chamberland 1
Clara Chamberland 10
Emily Chamberland 6
James Chamberland 35
Mary Ann Chamberland 30
Mary Ann Chamberland 11
Robert Chamberland 3


View
Original
Record

View original image

Thank you, Moggie - seems like I've been dogged by parallel James' right the way through but that is for me definitely the right lot!

Brick wall time again!!! Moggie, could you or any else kind enough double check 1841 & 1851 census' for James Chamberlain - the 1851 clearly has his occupation as 'Coal Porter' but the 1841 entry is less legible. However, there is that other 1841 census entry (HO107/1043/15) which lists a James as 'Carpenter', wife of same name but different children and address?
Seems a great coincidence, but is it just that?

Hi Robert
I have had another look at the 1841 census for James' (with son Robert)occupation and now I'm not sure that it does say carpenter. The enumerator has drawn a line through the word which I took to be the down stroke of the "p". There is a dot or it could be just a blob over the first part of the word.
I was curious to know what happened to Robert after the 1871 census when you found him in the asylum at Ipswich. I think he remained there for the rest of his life dying in 1903. This would account for Frances being down as married in 1881. 1891 and 1901 but with no husband present. This poses the question about Herbert's paternity. The only child that you can be certain was Roberts was your ancestor Peter James because the other children that Frances has living with her in 1871 were all born before their marriage in 1868.
I will copy in the details from the 1881, 1891 and 1901 census for what I think may be Robert and you can have a look for yourself and see what you think.
Moggie

1881 England Census
about R. C.
Name: R. C.
Age: 42
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1839
Relation: Patient
Gender: Male
Where born: Ipswich, Suffolk, England

Civil Parish: Ipswich St Clement
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England

Street address: "Ipswich Borough Asylum" Foxhall Road
Condition as to marriage: Married
Education:

Employment status: View Image
Occupation: Waterman

Registration district: Ipswich
Sub-registration district: St Clement

1891 England Census
about R Chamberland
Name: R Chamberland
Age: 52
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1839
Relation: Inmate
Gender: Male

Civil Parish: St Clement
Ecclesiastical parish: St Bartholomew
Town: Ipswich
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Ipswich
Sub-registration district: Ipswich Eastern
ED, institution, or vessel: Borough Asylum

Chamberlain on image, married occupation waterman.

1901 England Census
about R C
Name: R C
Age: 62
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1839
Relation: Patient
Gender: Male

Civil Parish: St Clement
Ecclesiastical parish: St Bartholomew
Town: Ipswich
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Ipswich
Sub-registration district: Ipswich Eastern
ED, institution, or vessel: Borough Asylum

Single? Barge/waterman

Thanks again, Moggie - is this inmate Robert indeed the person in question. I've accidentally deleted my original downloaded record of the 'lunatic,' but the following I've taken by my reply on a previous thread:

"Well, I have visited the census' for 1841-61, which shows a Robert Chamberlain resident in Ipswich, but no record of a marriage or mention at all after 1861. There is the aforementioned inmate who was about 24 in 1871 (if he were father to this Robert who was 3 in 1841, that would have made him about 15)".

Then there's the matter of the 'Robe Chamberlain' born c1806 which Chrisa found earlier on this thread...
Sorry to be a pest, but I'm hoping you won't give up on this now! You've given me the kindest and greatest help so far.

Hi Moggie, that's where I was going wrong - on the census of 1871 it says that Robert is aged 24, but your further superb research has shown that this is an error somewhere down the line and that the subsequent census' show the correct estimate of birth. Brilliant! I found him to be a lodger aged 22 in the 1861 census.
I would like to access images (to download) of the 1881-1901 census results , but am not able to find them under the usual standard search. Could you point me in the right direction please?
Thanks...

Hi Robert
I was a bit confused because the age of R C in 1881 was 42
R Chamberland in 1891 was 52 and
R C in 1901 was 62 but the
one that you found in 1871 was only 24.
I have now looked at this entry and his age has been transcribed as 34. On the actual image the enumerator has put a thick pencil line through the age making it difficult to see if it is 24 or 34.
I think that this is the same person who spent over 30 years in the asylum.
Moggie

1871 England Census
about Roberts Chamberlain
Name: Roberts Chamberlain Married
Age: 34
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1837
Relation: Patient
Gender: Male
Where born: Ipswich, Suffolk, England
Civil Parish: Ipswich St Clement
Ecclesiastical parish: St Clement
Town: Ipswich
County/Island: Suffolk
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation: Waterman

1881 census
Leave completly blank.
At the bottom is RG/11 Put in 1874 in the piece box and 119 in the folio box.
This should find him as R C.
Moggie

1891 census
Leave blank
RG12/ Piece 1473 Folio 155
Listed as R Chamberland
Moggie

1901 census
Leave blank
RG/13 Piece 1781 Folio 144
Listed as R C

Just off to watch Eastenders
Get back to me if you have any problems finding the entries.
Moggie

Hope you enjoyed Eastenders, Moggie.
I'm afraid you'll have to explain how I obtain views of the records. I feel so hopeless at this, but perhaps one day I can help someone else in their genealogical endeavours!

Hi Robert
If you send me a PM (click on my name)
and give me your e mail address I will send you the images.
Moggie

Received with thanks, Moggie. Can't begin to tell you how very poignant that is to see those documents, but also much relief that certain problems are resolved in this quest. Well done!