Find Ancestors

lancashireann - thankyou, will do.

Found my Caister Edith Harvey in the marriage records and then the 1911. Turns out she married a barman called Ernest Chellis in 1907 and by 1911 had a 3 year old daughter Edith.

Was so sure it was her somehow.

Going to go back to Carbrooke census and see what I can find there.

If anyone could do a parish register lookup on ancestry for me for the baptism of Edith Eva May Harvey before 13th August 1910 (the date of their wedding) I would be very grateful. The church was the Parish Church, Leatherhead, Surrey (though they have spelt it letherhead on the marriage cert).

might be worth putting up a temporary thread just asking for the baptism lookup as more likely to be seen on its own

Not having much luck finding Leatherhead baptisms. I don't have the right ancestry sub to look at the parish records. Had a look on some different sites but can't find any records transcribed for that church.

lancashireann - good idea! Yes it was a church marriage. 'The parish church in the parish of Leatherhead (spelt letherhead) Surrey' according to the cert. Hopefully the baptism records for there are easier to search than the norfolk ones.

Mrs Grumpy - Definitely a long haul! But worth a try I should think if everything else fails.

If she was illegitimate then maybe Harvey would not have been her name at birth?

Have you tried looking at potential spouses for George Harvey and then checking to see if you can find a birth for Edith with any of those spouses' surnames? Long haul but it might work.

Jill

I was thinking of perhaps a baptism in the church where she married (Epsom district?). Maybe only even the day before if the minister refused to marry them in church unless she was baptised - assuming that it was a church marriage

Lancashireann - yes I immediately thought Gamekeeper. It is similar line of work to her future husband's family. But I haven't found any George Harvey's with any sort of Keeper occupation that I could think off. The mind boggles at why you would just put keeper as an occupation!

I haven't had much luck searching baptisms, couldn't find any records really. I think I tried freebmd and the mormons websites. I should imagine there are better sites which I don't have a subscription for. I'm still trying to get the hang of ancestry - I either get 22,000 results or none! I only looked around her year of birth so I will go back and search for later years. I'm sure I'm not getting the right results though because, if I remember correctly, I did a wide search for Edith Harvey's in Norfolk c1883 and found no baptism records at all!

some extra thoughts perhaps

in Norfolk I would guess that keeper would most likely be some form of countryside keeper - gamekeeper type

have you looked for a baptism just before she married. I have one ancestor who was just Jane on her birth certificate but was baptised just before she married adding the name Adelaide.

Thank you Mrs Grumpy - I managed to rule out the police connection (Sorry, I should have mentioned that one, have done so much searching I forget to mention some bits). I found the Edith Harvey with the father George who was a Police Seargent in the 1911 census, she was still living with her father and was working as a school mistress. Obviously, any edith harvey's that I can later find on the 1911 can be ruled out beause I know which entry is definitely my Edith Eva May.

I have checked the whole 1891 census for Carbrooke - maybe I should check the 1901 census too. I can imagine it would be quite easy to think you had been born somewhere if your earliest memories are form there.


How it hadn't occurred to me that she might have been born illigit is beyond me - so many of my tree seem to have been and the rest of them have been easy to trace! That said, if she was illigit then she would also have not been born in Norfolk as I have all the certs from the Edith Harvey's born in Norfolk c 1883 and they all had father's listed. The father's name on the marriage cert was George Harvey, so I would assume if she was illigit then she must have been adopted by this george as they had the same surname?

Still can't shake this strong feeling it is the caister one - seems to be a bit silly to go on gut instinct really. I'm going to see if I can find her marriage this evening.

Thank you so much for the pointers - very helpful to get a different perspective.

Just some thoughts.

It's possible that although she stated she was born in Carbrooke she could have been born anywhere. Maybe the family moved when she was very young so her earliest memories were of Carbrooke and she assumed she had been born there. (That happened to one of mine.)

If you don't know where in the family she sits it is possible that she was illegitimate and her mother married George after Edith's birth. (That happened to a few of mine.)

Check out the dates of when police officers came into being. It's possible that he had a change of occupation ...

I wonder if "keeper" means someone connected with a jail - someone connected with the police?

Sorry - not much concrete help but maybe an idea or two you could try.

Jill

Does anyone have any further ideas for me on this one before I give up looking for her? (not that I want to but it is costing me a small fortune and is driving me mad!)

Here is where I am up to

Her birth place is given in 1911 census as Carbrooke, Norfolk (Wayland district). - The only edith harvey born in that district around that time was not born in Carbrooke and has a father called John.

Her father is given on her marriage cert as George Harvey, a 'Keeper'. She was married in 1910, in the 1911 census I can't find a george harvey with anything similar to that occupation and I can't find one before that either so maybe they gave that occupation to make him sound a bit more important in his employment than he might have been?

I cannot find any records prior to 1910 for an Edith Eva May Harvey so now I am wondering if she just adopted the middle names herself? They are given on her marriage certificate, the 1911 census and the death certificate.

The only edith harvey born anywhere in norfolk at around the right time with a father called george that I haven't been able to rule out was born in Caister, Norfolk (Flegg district) in 1883. I have her birth certificate here and her name is given as just Edith Harvey. I cannot find this edith harvey in 1911 so I imagine she was married by then. I'm currently trying to find her marriage record (she was single in the 1901). I think that if I can't find her in the 1911 then maybe she is my edith harvey (since I can't find mine before 1910). Effectively this would mean that prior to her marriage she was just Edith Harvey and that sometime just before she got married she adopted the middle names Eva May from somewhere and started using them. It would also mean that on the 1911 census a mistake had been made and that the place Carbrooke had been incorrectly recorded. How likely is this?

I can't find any baptism records for an Edith Harvey in Wayland - though I think there are gaps in the transcribed records. I have searched the 1881 and 1891 Carbrooke census for any Harvey's but cannot find any that match.

Is there anything I haven't thought of that might help me confirm or certainly rule out that the edith harvey born in Caister is not the Edith Eva May Harvey I am looking for pre-1910? I know an awful lot about this Caister Edith Harvey but just have no firm link that she is my Edith Eva May Harvey

After all, I cannot understand why the place of birth given in the 1911 census would be wrong by many miles!

Sorry, I know there is a lot of information here.I didn;t want anyone to go searching fo rhitngs I already knew. Just soooo disappointed I cannot discover her side of the family tree.

Thanks for reading all this!

Lancashireann,

I don't think so. Smallburgh is quite far away from where (according to the 1911 census) she was born, but then so is casiter where I am focussing on right now!

Smallburgh is a huge district so it took some time to search. The only Edith Harvey born there that I could find was an Edith J Harvey b c1883 with father Henry. I found this one in the 1901 living in Hammersmith and working as a dressmaker. That said, I cannot find her before then.

So if this female did eventually became an Edith, I'm guessing it would be that one.

Thank you for your help though. I am well and truely stuck!

was the Smallburgh one no good Jennifer?

Jennifer,
Hopefully she will turn up. Thanks

Regards Vera

Thanks for the n Vera.

The casiter certifacte arrived but without any middle names. It is the closest match of all the certificates I can find so what I am trying to do now is see if there is a baptism record for this Edith Harvey with these parents that gives the middle names Eva May

I have started another thread (probably should have continued on this one really - sorry folks) in the hope that someone could do a look up for me. Not having much luck so far though.

n

I have no idea of the geography of Norfolk, but is this any good?

Births Sep 1884 (>99%)
Harvey Female Smallburgh 4b 57

Well, yes I have absolutely no idea what sort of Keeper he was. I googled and found inn-keepers, game-keepers, store-keepers, livery yard-keepers and even a pool table keeper! I can't think of any type of keeper that would be police related and I would think it unlikely he would change from that profession. Most inconsiderate of them really not to spare a thought for me 100 years later trying to find out all about them and guessing what sort of keeper he was.

I'll let you know what happens when the Caister certificate arrives.

I'm assuming that if she used the middle names Eva May for her mariage certificate they would also be on her birth certificate? Did she have to give a copy of her birth certificate to prove her identity at marriage? I have a horrible feeling I'm not going to get the answer I want to hear from those two questions! Does anyone know?

Jennifer,
That is the problem with family treeing......I can only tell what I did to find my grandmothers birth, I must have sent for 5 birth certificate if not more. Trouble is it costs as we know !!! But I did find her...I was sooooo pleased.


I might be wrong.....but the Edith Harvey with the policeman father (1901 census) surely she would have put police man etc on her marriage certificate....

Is keeper another name for a policeman ???


Oh, I do hope you find her....please if you don't mind, keep me informed.


Regards Vera