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Hi Victoria

It seems i may have the marriage of Samuel Savage and OLive Minns all wrong.
Any sign of Samuel George Savage having to come to australia on his own please.
Joan

Hi Victoria
I have been trying to find evidence that Samuel actually came to Aus for a long time, and haven't been able to find anything. So i am going along with your idea about him never having left the uk. Lets see where that leads me.
Thanks so much for your help
Joan

Hi again
Having looked through the Savage info i have, i think that Olive Minns may well be wrong. The names i have fro Samuels siblings are all born in West Ham so Samuel isn't likely yo have been born in Woolwich. So i now have to find Samuel from W Hams wife. Hope i'm on the right track
Joan

Dear Moody Blue
Thanks very much for the PM. I am going to UK at the end of this month (volcano permitting) and was hoping to do some follow up on Samuel Savage while i was there. So the info you have given me will be a big help. Although Victoria has put the idea in my head that he may not even have come to Aus at all has left me very confused. I need to sit down and really go through all the info i have and try and work out whats what. Just wish there was someone left alive that could set me straight. This is not an easy task. Thanks again for all your help
Joan

nudge

Do you have the marriqge certificate for Samuel George & Olive Emily? If not, it would be a good idea to perhaps purchase it . At the very least, it would clarify which family Samuel George belonged to..........West Ham versus Woolwich!

This looks like the Samuel George Savage born Woolwich in Dec 1907 and the one that most likely married Olive Emily Minns:-

1911 census transcription details for: 12 Portland Road Mottingham
National Archive Reference:
RG14PN3719 RG78PN140 RD42 SD4 ED15 SN180

Reg. District: Bromley Sub District: Chislehurst
Parish: Mottingham Enum. District: 15
Address: 12 Portland Road Mottingham
County: Kent
Name Relation Condition/
Yrs married Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation Where Born
SAVAGE, Robert Head Married M 56 1855 Fire Brigade Pensioner Store Causton Norfolk
SAVAGE, Rose Wife Married
6 years F 31 1880 Tillington Hereford
SAVAGE, Robert Son M 5 1906 Woolwich Kent
SAVAGE, Samuel Son M 3 1908 Woolwich Kent
SAVAGE, Walter Son M 1 1910 Mottingham Kent

and Olive Emily Minns in 1911:-

1911 census transcription details for: 11b Balfour Road South Norwood
National Archive Reference:
RG14PN3380 RG78PN127 RD39 SD4 ED13 SN169

Reg. District: Croydon Sub District: North Croydon
Parish: Croydon Enum. District: 13
Address: 11b Balfour Road South Norwood
County: Surrey
Name Relation Condition/
Yrs married Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation Where Born
MINS, Frederick William Head Married M 31 1880 Engineer Sth Norwood
MINS, Adeline Jessie Wife Married
7 years F 31 1880 Penge
MINS, Arthur Jessie Son M 5 1906 East Ham
MINS, Olive Emily Daughter F 2 1909 East Ham

This would seem to be the birth for Samuel George Savage born Leyton as per the 1911 census, but then he does not appear to be the one that married Olive Minns:-

Births Jun 1906
Savage Samuel George W. Ham 4a 373

This one below looks the more likely candidate to have married Olive Emily Minns:-

Births Dec 1907
SAVAGE Samuel George Woolwich 1d 1186

(see deaths in previous postings)

Births Jun 1939 (94%)
Savage Clive A Minns Woolwich 1d 1291


Ok must have been seeing things----must ge tnew glasesses

see what I mean....

i spent some time on this today and have found no evidence of them in Australia. the second child was born very soon prior to the outbreak of war so maybe they had planned to go and didn't .


unless someone can prove me wrong, I don't think they ever came to Oz

The other birth is CLIVE A Savage and not Olive A Savage


There is a marriage for him in Lewisham district 3rd qtr 1960

am sending a pm re address & tel no, Clives birth and marriage details

Births Mar 1909
MINNS Olive Emily W. Ham 4a 235

Marriages Mar 1932
Minns Olive E Savage Croydon 2a 626
Savage Samuel G Minns Croydon 2a 626

Was wondering if perhaps the family returned to England as there is also this death..............


England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2005
about Olive Emily Savage
Name: Olive Emily Savage
Birth Date: 4 Dec 1908
Death Registration Month/Year: 1978
Registration district: Stevenage
Inferred County: Hertfordshire
Volume: 10
Page: 1198


and then perhaps the marriage above could be their daughter?

Or more interestingly, perhaps they didn't emigrate afterall?


England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2005
about Samuel George Savage
Name: Samuel George Savage
>>>>>>Birth Date: 11 Oct 1907
Death Registration Month/Year: Jan 1987
Age at death (estimated): 79
Registration district: Stevenage
Inferred County: Hertfordshire
Volume: 10
Page: 1069

corresponding birth:-
Births Dec 1907
SAVAGE Samuel George Woolwich 1d 1186

Hi Victoria.
Appreciate the trouble you have gone to for me. As i have been told he came to australia before the second world war i doubt the marriage would be of his daughter. Thank you again
Joan

I wonder if this is Pamela getting married in England

England & Wales, Marriage Index: 1916-2005
Marriage & Divorce

View Image
Preview
Name: Pamela O Savage
Spouse Surname: Bramwell
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1958
Registration district: Ilford
Registration county (inferred): Essex
Volume Number: 5a
Page Number: 1109

Take a look at the picture to see even more.

See more
Name: Pamela O Savage
Spouse: Bramwell
Marriage: Jul-Aug-Sep 1958 - Ilford, Essex


EDIT there are other Pamela O Savage's born around 1935 in England

thye seem to have had 2 children in England b Woolwich

Pamela O b. Mar 1935.
Olive A b. Jun 1939

I'll bear that in mind. Just wish i had a bit of an idea what i was doing.

Hi.Many thanks for the reply. Not quite sure what to make of it. Something else for me to look into. I have word that he could possible gone to Western Aus. Any suggestions as to where i may start looking. Just don't know where to begin.
Thanks Joan

Don't let the mother's name deter you.
I have an Austrailian death cert where the mother's name has been recorded as that of his 1st wife !
When people have died after emigrating, such details are not always known by those registering the death.

For info only:

National Archive Reference:
RG14PN9640 RG78PN513A RD188 SD9 ED7 SN15

Reg. District: West Ham Sub District: North Leyton
Parish: Low Leyton Enum. District: 7
Address: 22 Huxley Road Leyton
County: Essex
Name Relation Condition/
Yrs married Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation Where Born
SAVAGE, William Robert Head Married M 43 1868 Commercial Traveller Norfolk Balsham
SAVAGE, Beatrice Catherine Wife Married
23 years F 43 1868 House Wife London City
SAVAGE, Frederick Claude Son Single M 19 1892 Accountants Company's Secretary Essex Leyton
SAVAGE, Florence Ethel Daughter Single F 17 1894 Nil Essex Leyton
SAVAGE, Dorothy Rose Daughter Single F 15 1896 Nil Essex Leyton
SAVAGE, Victor Willie Robert Son M 8 1903 School Essex Leyton
SAVAGE, Edward Albert Son M 7 1904 School Essex Leyton
SAVAGE, Samuel George Son M 4 1907 School Essex Leyton
FAIRHAM, Eliza Mother In Law Widow F 73 1838 Cook Retired Notts Nottingham
FAIRHAM, Ada Blanche Lillian Sister In Law Single F 33 1878 Draper Assistant Essex Leyton


Really not convinced about this one being correct!!
New South Wales Australia
His death maybe?...........although mothers name is different......... but same father's names?

Registration Number Last Name Given Name(s) Father's Given Name(s) Mother's Given Name(s) District Purchase Certificate
2563/1948 SAVAGE SAMUEL GEORGE WILLIAM ROBERT MARGARET CHATSWOOD Buy Now

Thanks for the tip