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I am searching for any information, regarding Richard Jones who in 1893 lived with his wife Dorothy (nee Rees) at 95 Brunswick Road, West Derby. Their son Robert Percival Rees Jones was born on 27/1/1893 at this address. Richard was a Chemist and Druggist. His wife Dorothy was born in Lledrod, Cardiganshire in1863. By the 1901 census, Robert had lost both parents and was living with his aunth back at Lledrod. I would be grateful for any leads regarding Richards birth, marrage or death.
Best regards Gwyn

Now this is speculation, but its in the correct area and about the right time

This marriage

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page

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Marriages Jun 1885 (>99%)
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;Johnson John West Derby 8b 677
Rees Dorothy West Derby 8b 677

No definite death fof John Johnson(very common name)


and then this set

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page

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Marriages Sep 1892 (>99%)
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BURROWES Richard W. Derby 8b 953
GREEN Mary Catherine W. Derby 8b 953
>>>Johnson Dorothy W. Derby 8b 953
>>>Jones Richard W. Derby 8b 953



Might be completly wrong, only a possible

Andy

Thanks Andy, will check all avenues aqvailable

Best regards Gwyn

Think Andy may be onto something, this looks like Dorothy on the 1891 census:

Dorothy Johnson
Age 27
Estimated Year of Birth 1864
Relationship to Head of Household Wife
Occupation
Address 49, Becket Street
District West Derby, Kirkdale
Parish Kirkdale
Administrative County Lancashire
Birth Place Aberystwith, Bromnant
Birth County Cardiganshire

Not very clear on original but this is what I think it says:

Husband John Johnson, 33 Clark CLG Ply Co born West Derby, can't make out the area

Lodger Richard Jones 34 Chemists Assistant born A?? Wales - according to transcript it is St Asaph

This is the nearest match for a death:

Deaths Dec 1891 (>99%)

Johnson John 32 W. Derby 8b 317

Looks good Flip. Nice find. So she married the Lodger....!

Just spent time looking for the ancestry version

1891 England Census
about Richard Jones
Name: Richard Jones
Age: 34
Estimated birth year: abt 1857
Relation: Lodger
Gender: Male
Where born: Astph, Wales

Civil Parish: Kirkdale
Ecclesiastical parish: St Athanasius
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: Kirkdale
ED, institution, or vessel: 28
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
John Johnson 33
Honoraty Johnson 27
Richard Jones 34

So ancestry are just as bad as GR for mis-transcribing names, it's Dorothy on the original don't know where they got Honoraty.

Not much luck trying for Richard's birth, even using the St Asaph reg. district only there are still too many to confirm which one it is.

Gwyn, you may need to get the Dorothy/Richard marriage certificate to find their fathers names & occupations to try to find on earlier census records.

How are you sure they both died before the 1901 census?

By the 1901 census, Robert Percival Rees Jones was living with his aunty in Lledrod, I have his birth certificate. His mother was Dorothy Rees and Father Richard Jones. It is common knowledge that his parents died young and left him orphaned. I have Dorothy's 1871 & 1881 census but nothing for 1891, under Jones or Rees. Then re-appears on Robert's birth certificate in 1893, living at Brunswick Rd. Her fathers name was John Rees, and was a mason. I am unable to find any marrage details for this pair so that I can trace Richards family line.

Thank you all for your help Gwyn.

But the marriage posted by Andy for 1892, and the census for 1891 would point to her marrying twice, and the first husband died. I think the 1892 certificate should prove this and give Richards father so we can have another go at his ancestry.

Yes I've sent for their marrage certificate, looks like the lodger wasup to no good.??????????
Thanks Flip

Maybe, maybe not, her husband died when they were very young - maybe she just took some comfort from the lodger!

Let us know when the marriage cert arrives to see if we are on the right track.

Andy

nudge

Thanks for the help, much appreciated, will post results of certificate when it arrives.
Best Regards Gwyn

Richard and Dorothy married on the 31/7/1892. He a bachelor, her a widow. His father John Jones deceased, a Draper. Hers John Rees deceased, builder. So she matches up with what I found out about her family. so now I have to research his?

Hi Gwyn,

Well good news and bad - at least we were on the right track with the marriages! But why don't you pick some rellies with more unusual names - having a father John Jones doesn't make it easy does it?

Will have a look at the census records see what comes up though - you never know we may get lucky.

atb
Flip

No luck so far, think we need some more help with this Please!

I can find various combinations of Richard living with John on 1861 census on FMP but dont have the sub to check them out, then when I come back to GR find it impossible to get them.

Also, can't search by occupation on 1871 on FMP - don't know why?

Found a John Jones, looks like J tailor, could be junior tailor? in 1841 Census for St Asaph. Then again in 1851, married with 3 sons the youngest being Richard, also on the 1861 census with Robert and Richard still at home. Also birth of Richard Jones at St Asaph 1851, xxv11 225.

1861 Wales Census
Name: Richard Jones
Age: 10
Estimated birth year: abt 1851
Relation: Son
Father's name: John Jones
Mother's name: Elinor Jones
Gender: Male
Where born: St Asaph, Flintshire, Wales
Civil Parish or Township: Brynpolyn
County/Island: Denbighshire
Country: Wales
Street address: High Street

Occupation: Scholar

Registration district: St Asaph
Sub-registration district: St Asaph
Household Members:
Name Age
John Jones 43 - tailor & draper
Elinor Jones 62 - [I think she's 42]
Robert Jones 13
Richard Jones 10

All born St Asaph.

j tailor ............. ??? probably means journeyman tailor

ie, one who has completed his apprenticeship (usualy about 7 years)



sylvia