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Help I am stuck again, can anyone help me with finding more info please,

From info I have I think Hugh's Farther Samuel Irvine was born about 1834.

He married Mary Ann Fowls July 1875, and was down as a widower.

On the 1901 census Mary is head of the family.

So can anyone help me to find out, Where Samuel was born (I think his fathers name was James) also any info on his first marriage, and if he had any children in that marriage,also any info on his death, I think he
Died aged 61 in 1895, but don't know were.

Many thanks to all.
Mike

Yes Michael, I think they are the same family, if you look at the original census the name is Irvine, it been transcribed wrong. Mary Anne signs her name with a mark, because she can't read or write, back then people got very little schooling, so there's going to be decrepancies in their spelling & counting. Look at your message in your inbox I sent you Hugh marriage.

Hi Maura
Thanks once again for latest info its all great stuff.

I noticed on the1901 census info you find-: Mary Anne Irwin @ age 46 widow , Margaret Fowles age 43,Agnes Irwin age 13. Then on the 1911
census Mary Anne Irvine age 63, Margaret Fowls age 64,and Agnes Irvine age 22, even though the census is only ten years later. Do you think we are looking at the same family even though all the names match and it fits Agnes, or is there another reason for the discrepancy?
Also why do you think the surname has gone from Irvine to Irwin in 1901 census, then in 1911 census one family has kept Irwin and one family gone back to Irvine, in 1901 census David is spelt Irwin, and in recent info his surname is again Irvine.

Would very much appreciate your thoughts on this.
Thank you very much.
Mike.

Hugh's brother

David Irvine married Amy Margaret Newcombe 20th April 1908 Saint Donards Church of Ireland KnockBreda Co Down

Residents of a house 17 in Movilla Street (Newtownards Urban, Down)
Show all information
Surname Forename Age Sex Relation to head Religion Birthplace Occupation Literacy Irish Language Marital Status Specified Illnesses Years Married Children Born Children Living
Irvine David 25 Male Head of Family Church of Ireland Co Down Hackler Read and write English Married - 2 - -
Irvine Amy Margaret 25 Female Wife Church of Ireland England - Read and write English Married - 2 1 1
Irvine Elice Ruth 1 Female Daughter Church of Ireland Co Down -

Michael you won't get BMD's for Northern Ireland after 1922 online.

Name: Letitia Irvine
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date:
Baptism/Christening Place:
Birth Date: 09 Jun 1879
Birthplace: Newtownards, Down, Ireland
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: Samuel Irvine
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Mary Ann Fowles Irvine
Mother's Birthplace:
Mother's Age:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C00721-7
System Origin: Ireland-ODM
Source Film Number: 256027
Reference Number:
Collection: Ireland Births and Baptisms, 1620-1881

possible sister
Name: Ann Jane Ervine
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date:
Baptism/Christening Place:
Birth Date: 16 May 1876
Birthplace: Down, Ireland
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: Samuel Ervine
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Mary Ann Ervine Fowler
Mother's Birthplace:
Mother's Age:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C00642-7
System Origin: Ireland-ODM
Source Film Number: 255951
Reference Number:
Collection: Ireland Births and Baptisms, 1620-1881

This is the only birth I can find for Hugh in Newtonards
Name: Hugh Irvine
Registration District: Newtownards
Event Type: BIRTHS
Registration Quarter and Year: Oct - Dec 1884
Estimated Birth Year:
Age (at Death):
Mother's Maiden Name:
Film Number: 101060
Volume Number: 1
Page Number: 757
Digital Folder Number: 4193461
Image Number: 00307
Collection: Ireland, Civil Registration Indexes, 1845-1958

Hi rootgatherer

Thanks for help will try that.

Michael, you can look here for possible BMDs.

https://www.familysearch.org/

Can anyone help me with the Birth, Death dates of Hugh Irvine married to Elizabeth McCleane 1908 mentioned earlier,

Thanks
Mike

Hi Maura
Just got back to GR and suprised and pleased with all the info youve given
me thanks, its gave me somthing to work on, whatever else you can let me know is much apprecieated.

once again thanks.
Mike

* Census Years
* 1911
* Down
* Newtownards Urban
* Movilla Street
* Residents of a house

Residents of a house 37 in Movilla Street (Newtownards Urban, Down)
Show all information
Surname Forename Age Sex Relation to head Religion Birthplace Occupation Literacy Irish Language Marital Status Specified Illnesses Years Married Children Born Children Living
Irvine Mary Anne 63 Female Head of Family Church of Ireland Co Armagh, Lurgan Sewiers Cannot read - Widow - 43 8 4
Irvine Agnes 22 Female Daughter Church of Ireland Co Down, Dundonald Office Cleaner Read and write - Single - - - -
Rea Alice 1 Female Grand Daughter Church of Ireland Belfast - Cannot read - Single - - - -
Fowls Maggie 64 Female Sister Presbyterian Co Armagh, Lurgan Children Servant Cannot read - Single - - - -
Stevenson Agnes 73 Female Boarder Presbyterian

Again 1901 misspelt,

* Census Years
* 1901
* Down
* Newtownards Urban
* Greenwell Street
* Residents of a house

Residents of a house 25 in Greenwell Street (Newtownards Urban, Down)
Show all information
Surname Forename Age Sex Relation to head Religion Birthplace Occupation Literacy Irish Language Marital Status Specified Illnesses
Irwin Agnes 13 Female Daughter Church of Ireland Co Down Scholar Read and write - Not Married -
Irwin Mary Anne 46 Female Head of Family Church of Ireland Co Armagh Lodging House Keeper Cannot read - Widow -
Fowles Margaret 43 Female Sister Presbyterian Co Armagh House Work Read only - Not Married -
Irwin Hugh 18 Male Son Church of Ireland Co Down Labourer Read and write - Not Married -
Irwin David 15 Male Son Church of Ireland Co Down Hackler Read and write

Samuel Irvine married Mary Anne Fowls 12th July 1875 St Mark's C.O.I. Newtonards

Samuel father's a James
Mary Anne father's a Hugh

Had a look at the full marriage and Hugh Address is 74 Movilla street newtonards, going with the 1911 census their is a family that fits,plus they are mixed marriage which would tally with them marrying in a registry office. But the names coming up Irwin

Residents of a house 39 in Movilla Street (Newtownards Urban, Down)
Show all information
Surname Forename Age Sex Relation to head Religion Birthplace Occupation Literacy Irish Language Marital Status Specified Illnesses Years Married Children Born Children Living
Irwin Hugh 28 Male Head of Family Church of Ireland Co Down General Labourer Read and write - Married - - - -
Irwin Elizabeth 22 Female Wife Roman Catholic Co Antrim - Read and write - Married - 4 3 3
Irwin Mary Jane 3 Female Daughter Roman Catholic Co Down - Cannot read - Single - - - -
Irwin Hugh 2 Male Son Roman Catholic Co Down - Cannot read - Single - - - -
Irwin Samuel Male Son Roman Catholic Co Down

The only marriage I can find for a Hugh Irvine to a Elizabeth in newtonards

Hugh Irvine married a Elizabeth McCleane 5th March 1908 Newtonards Registry office. Hugh father's a Samuel & Elizabeth's father a Thomas.

Name: George Irvine
Registration District: Newtownards
Event Type: BIRTHS
Registration Quarter and Year: Apr - Jun 1921
Estimated Birth Year:
Age (at Death):
Mother's Maiden Name:
Film Number: 101079
Volume Number: 1
Page Number: 820
Digital Folder Number: 4194698
Image Number: 00097
Collection: Ireland, Civil Registration Indexes, 1845-1958

you can order it from here www.groni.gov.uk

Hi Flick

Thanks for info so far, I have copy of George's marriage cert..... and it gives
his father Hugh as a Retired Railway man in 1949.

Mike

These are the Hugh Irvines in Co Down in 1911

Irvine Hugh Harvey Street Pottinger (part of) Down 12 M Belfast Scholars Irish Church Read and write Son Single
Irvine Hugh Dundela Street Victoria (part of) Down 27 M County Down Gardner Servant Domestic Presbyterian Read and write Son Single
Irvine Hugh High Street Newry North Urban Down 67 M Co Down Labour (General) Roman Catholic Cannot read Head of Family Married
Irvine Hugh Lisnastrean Ballymacbrennan Down 24 M Co Down Caulker in Ship Building Yard Presbyterian Read and write Son Single
Irvine Hugh Robinson Newtownards Road Upper Victoria (part of) Down 41 M Co Down General Practitioner ? Presbyterian Read and write Head of Family Married 12
Irvine Hugh A Drumlee Ballyward Down 50 M Co Armagh B A, R A I Presbyterian Clergyman Presbyterian Read and write Head of Family Married

Hi Potty
I have deleted the thread as requested, sorry abt that,but am new to this,

The birth certificate I have for George Irvine must be the short version, it is dated 1958,issued from Register of births office in Newtownards NI, He was born in 1921, I dont know what the reason was for the
copy, must have lost the original,he was married in Essex in 1949.

Can you advise best way of getting a copy of full cert.
Many thanks.
Mike.

duplicates are not allowed by GR either

Michael, please can you delete your previous thread about this family. It is confusing to have more than one thread about the same people.

If his parents names aren't on his birth cert, I wonder if it is a short version? Is there a space on it for his parents' names? If not, I think it might help to get a full cert.