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Conundrum

ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Cynthia

Cynthia Report 21 May 2025 19:56

Thank you. There seem to be endless possibilities at the moment. I am taking it all on board - so to speak. :-)

ErikaH

ErikaH Report 21 May 2025 19:43

The child baptised in 1897 was born 23rd March1894, according to LanOPC.

Father’s occupation: Corporation Labourer. Address: 24, Manchester Street

Not at that address in 1901, but there are people named Hyde there in 1891

ErikaH

ErikaH Report 21 May 2025 19:35

George is ‘Nephew’ in 1901………

ArgyllGran

ArgyllGran Report 21 May 2025 19:28

???
HYDE, ELIZABETH ANN mmn BLACKWELL
GRO Reference: 1896 S Quarter in SALFORD Volume 08D Page 132


Elizabeth Ann Hyde
in the England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name Elizabeth Ann Hyde
Gender Female
Baptism Date 12 May 1897
Baptism Place England, Lancashire, Salford
Father Peter Hyde
Mother Elizabeth Ann
FHL Film Number 1786461
Reference ID p43


There is no record of a Hyde/Blackwell marriage.
Could the mother be Elizabeth Ann Blackwell, nee Durden ???

ADDED:

but maybe this is that child's death:

Deaths Sep 1897 (>99%)
Hyde Elizabeth Ann 1 Salford 8d 39

ArgyllGran

ArgyllGran Report 21 May 2025 18:48

??
DURDEN, WILLIAM mmn TRAYNOR
GRO Reference: 1855 S Quarter in MANCHESTER Volume 08D Page 216


Marriages Sep 1854 (>99%)
Durden Joseph Manchester 8d 473
Trayner Elizabeth Manchester 8d 473


However, I don't see the birth of a sister Elizabeth Ann, who might have gone on to marry John Henry Blackwell.

ArgyllGran

ArgyllGran Report 21 May 2025 18:33

William and Amelia's marriage;

William Durden
in the Manchester, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1930
Name William Durden
Gender Male
Marriage Age 21
Event Type Marriage
Birth Year abt 1855
Marriage Date 17 Apr 1876
Marriage Place Deane, St Mary, Lancashire, England
Parish as it Appears Deane
Father
Joseph Durden [labourer *******]
Spouse
Amelia Nuttall
Reference Number GB127.L85/1/3/18

ArgyllGran

ArgyllGran Report 21 May 2025 18:28

George's birth - so could be the child of John Henry and Elizabeth Ann:

BLACKWELL, GEORGE mmn DURDEN
GRO Reference: 1889 D Quarter in SALFORD Volume 08D Page 154

When George married Ethel Brice in 1915, at Platt Bridge, he also didn't name a father.


Ancestry suggests this is John Henry's death - in which case, George and Elizabeth junior couldn't have been his children, but George could still have been registered as Blackwell, as that was his mother's name.

BLACKWELL, JOHN HENRY 25
GRO Reference: 1884 S Quarter in CHORLTON Volume 08C Page 574

ArgyllGran

ArgyllGran Report 21 May 2025 17:58

John Henry in 1881 - not that that's any help - but I can't see Elizabeth Ann so far:

John Blackwell
in the 1881 England Census
Name John Blackwell
Age 22
Estimated Birth Year abt 1859
Relationship to Head Son
Mother Ann Blackwell
Gender Male
Where born Hulme, Lancashire, England
Civil parish Hulme
County/Island Lancashire
Country England
Street Address 47 Lavender St
Occupation Marble Mason
Registration District Chorlton
ED, institution, or vessel 31
Neighbors
Piece 3929
Folio 94
Page number 23
Household Members (Name) Age Relationship
Ann Blackwell 63 Head
John Blackwell 22 Son

ArgyllGran

ArgyllGran Report 21 May 2025 17:45

For our reference:

Elizabeth Ann Durden
in the Manchester, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1930
Name Elizabeth Ann Durden
Gender Female
Marriage Age 23
Event Type Marriage
Birth Year abt 1860
Marriage Date 1 Jul 1883
Marriage Place Hulme, St Michael, Manchester, England
Parish as it Appears S Michael Hulme
Father Joseph Durden [ deceased, joiner ]
Spouse John Henry Blackwell [ marble lmason ]
Reference Number M320/7/2/2
Item Number 5
Archive Roll 818

Witnesses: Harry Thompson and Fanny Blackwell

John's address: 47 Lavender Street.
Elizabeth's address: 34 Victoria Street

However, I don't see them in 1891 so far.

Cynthia

Cynthia Report 21 May 2025 16:14

Good afternoon

I am looking for the birth of Elizabeth Ann Blackwell, who married Joseph Farrimond in Wigan in 1919. No father is given on the marriage certificate.

I have them on the 1921 census and 1939 register, where she gives her date of birth as 24/5/1896. They are still in Wigan.

Working backwards, on the 1911 census, I am looking at Elizabeth Ann Blackwell, adopted daughter and George Blackwell, adopted son of William and Amelia Jane Dearden. Both Elizabeth and George are stated to have been born in Salford.

On the 1901, George Blackwell is with this same family, with the spelling of Durden, not Dearden. No sign of Elizabeth Ann.

I have been on GRO, Lancs BMD, Lancs OPC but simply cannot find Elizabeth Ann anywhere.

Looking for a link with the Dearden (Durden) name, I found a marriage between a John Henry Blackwell and an Elizabeth Ann Durden in 1883, but haven't gone far with that.

Knowing how good some of you are at spotting the obvious, I thought I would pass it over for perusal, please. Many thanks. Cx