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Please can anyone find a marriage for::::: John Head,(born in Kent )& Elizabeth Jane LeCras,(born Jersey,C.I.),,,,,.... District or year unknown,but first child born Paddington,Middx 1867/68...Have searched registers & LDS but haven't found them......Many thanks..Eunice..

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Hi Jeanette, Have searched Ancestry, but they are not there,

Eunice this could be Elizabeth on the 1871 census, what were her children called? Agnes E Head abt 1870 Paddington, Middlesex, England Daughter Paddington London Elizabeth J Head abt 1838 St Helens, Jersey, Channel Islands Head Paddington London Herbert J Head abt 1868 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son Paddington London Source information: RG10/14 Registration district: Kensington Sub-registration district: St Mary Paddington ED, institution, or vessel: 32 Folio: 42 Page: 5 (click to see others on page) Household schedule number: 35 GSU Number: 838752 Georgina.

could be your Elizabeth in 1851- not sure if you had this Clara Le Cras abt 1850 St Helier, Jersey, Channel Islands Daughter St Helier Jersey Elizabeth Le Cras abt 1810 St Marie, Jersey, Channel Islands Wife St Helier Jersey >>Elizabeth Le Cras abt 1837 St Helier, Jersey, Channel Islands Daughter St Helier Jersey Ellen Le Cras abt 1843 St Helier, Jersey, Channel Islands Daughter St Helier Jersey James Le Cras abt 1839 St Helier, Jersey, Channel Islands Son St Helier Jersey John Le Cras abt 1841 St Helier, Jersey, Channel Islands Son St Helier Jersey James Lec Ras abt 1807 St Helier, Jersey, Channel Islands Head St Helier Jersey Ann Miller abt 1789 Scotland Lodger St Helier Jersey ---------------------------------------------------------------------- possibly 1861 View Record Elizabeth De Ste Croix abt 1837 St. Helier, Jersey, Channel Islands Servant St Helier Jersey

Hi Georgina, Yes that's them,I have them on 71,81 & 91 & John on previous census. Just wondering if perhaps they married in Jersey. Real problem these LeCras's

Eunice on the 1881 census Elizabeth is yet again home alone with her children (no sign of hubby) but it does say she is a Butlers wife and I have found the only John Head who is a Butler... John Head abt 1838 Seal, Kent, England Servant High Road Wentworth, Egham, Surrey, England Source information: RG11/1321 Registration district: Windsor Sub-registration district: Egham ED, institution, or vessel: 7 Folio: 144 Page: 15 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Agnes E. Head abt 1870 Paddington, Middlesex, England Daughter Knowle Hill, Egham, Surrey, England Arthur E. Head abt 1876 Egham, Surrey, England Son Knowle Hill, Egham, Surrey, England Elizabeth Head abt 1838 St Heliers, Jersey, Channel Islands Wife (Head) Knowle Hill, Egham, Surrey, England Herbert J. Head abt 1868 Paddington, Middlesex, England Son Knowle Hill, Egham, Surrey, England Source information: RG11/1321 Registration district: Windsor Sub-registration district: Egham ED, institution, or vessel: 6 Folio: 127 Page: 21 Georgina.

did you see elizabeth with her parents in 1851? what is your specific problem with the Le Cras family - or is she it?

Hi Jess, Many thanks for that,but there were 2 Elizabeth Jane LeCras's born around the same time,& it's just my luck that that one isn't mine. C.I FHS gave me the christening info.on both of them,but mine disappears until the 1871 England census.

Hi Jess, This whole family of LeCras's are a *** problem. Elizabeth J.(not the one on the 51) was the illegitimate daughter of my 2XGt Gran.Elizabeth Charlton formerly LeCras. Can't find Elizabeth snrs birth (In Jersey)or her marriage to George Charlton (b.Jersey).Been trying for 2 years I have the census details on the Charltons from '51-1901 in Woolwich,Kent. but they all seem invisible before that Even C.I.FHS cannot find records of them,apart from the illegitimate Elizabeth Jane.

Hi Georgina, Apologies for delay The butler John Head b.Seal,Kent is the correct one. I'm beginning to wonder if he & Elizabeth J.LeCras were actually married... Many thanks Eunice

Eunice I think they probably did marry but I think Elizabeth may have married under a different surname. If her mother married maybe she took her step fathers surname? Do you have any of the childrens birth certificates? Georgina.

Hi Georgina, I haven't sent for any of the children's BC's yet. They are on 'my waiting' list(I've spent so much on certs lately,I'm trying to cut down). This whole family is so complicated Her mother married? George Charlton,& on the census in Woolwich there are 4 children ...2 born St.Helier b.1843 & 44 & 2 born Woolwich.1856 & 58. ... Still trying to find out whether the 2 (Esther & Henry)born St.Helier,were George's by previous marriage or Elizabeth's(snrs)...or belonged to them both All in all they are causing headaches

Eunice if you look at the 1861 census with Elizabeth's mother on there is a visitor Elizabeth ??? aged 23 born Jersey. This has got to be your Elizabeth, right age, right birthplace. Her name has been transcribed as MUCH but the image looks different. If you have the 1861 census take a look and see if you can read her surname. Elizabeth Charlton abt 1818 Jersey, Channel Islands Wife Plumstead Kent Esther Charlton abt 1844 Jersey, Channel Islands Daughter Plumstead Kent Fredrick Charlton abt 1859 Plumstead, Kent, England Son Plumstead Kent George Charlton abt 1808 Jersey, Channel Islands Head Plumstead Kent Henry Charlton abt 1845 Jersey, Channel Islands Son Plumstead Kent Julia Charlton abt 1857 Plumstead, Kent, England Daughter Plumstead Kent Elizabeth Much abt 1839 Jersey, Channel Islands Visitor Plumstead Kent Source information: RG9/408 Registration district: Lewisham Sub-registration district: Plumstead ED, institution, or vessel: 2 Folio: 41 Page: 30 (click to see others on page) Household schedule number: 179 GSU Number: 542632 Georgina.

Hi Georgina, I have wondered whether she could possibly be the missing Elizabeth J. Her name is down as Elizabeth Much. I have traced her on the '41 C.I.census where she is down as a niece of aThomas LeCras.So there seems to be a family connection. I have asked C.I FHS to try to find info.on her. Waiting for their reply

Eunice if you look at the childrens ages on the 1861 census there is a big age gap so I would say this is a second marriage. Georgina.

Hi Georgina, That is what I suspect, CIFHS have searched for Esther & Henry 's birth under Charlton & LeCras & drawn a blank

Eunice I am off to bed let me know how you get on. Good luck. Georgina.

Hi Georgina, Thanks for your interest, I'm going to spend the night researching the Much name. Goodnight,sweet dreams. Eunice

Hi Georgina, Hooray, Found the marriage.. .. Elizabeth Much as visitor,on the 1861 IS the daughter (christened LeCras) John Head & Elizabeth Jane Much DecQ1864 Kensington. It looks as though Elizabeth Snr. was previously married to a Much Now it seems as though Esther & Henry were born as Much,as their births or christenings cannot be found as Charlton or LeCras. Another brickwall down ...