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dont think bmd is complete yet ,many of my rellies not on there either,just have to keep on checking for up dates, regards chloe d

I know!!! I never really asked my grandparents what life was like for them growing up, like what they thought about the Suffragette movement, about the murder of the Russian Tsar..... about.... anything!!! But I decided to ask when it was too late. i miss them.

Chloe Think of the stories they could tell you if they were...i was only thinking the other night how I would love to have a chat with my ggrandparents! Lou

Thanks Ben.... some part of me still wanted them to be alive though! LOL.

Yes I know the feeling. It is nice when you get that sledge hammer and smash that brick wall down to a pile of rubble. Good luck with your further research Chloe.

Thank YOOOOOUUUUU! I really don't know why I didn't see them. I have honestly looked myself. Thank you so much. I am really grateful. Chloe

Hi Chloe, Looks as though we have Maria as well. Maria F Perren aged 84 District Isliington Vol 1b Page 233. 1st Q 1923. Good Luck with the rest of your searching. Leon

Oh my God, you're a star, Leon!! How the hell did I miss that? have searched twice in the records office through the books. Grrrr, am kicking myself now. Thank you thank you thank you!!! Hope you enjoy your golf! Am at work, dead bored with paperwork! Chloe

Hi Chloe, I think we have him. James E Perren Died aged 78 2nd Q 1914 Islington Vol 1b Page 266. I am off to Golf now will have a look for Maria on my return Leon

Thanks Leon. It is really appreciated. As for the marriage in 1859 and the death in 1882. Thanks John but the death is not him. He was alive in 1901. And the marriage entry should read PERREN, not PERRIN. It's my surname, and I'm sure you can understand the frustration when people spelling it wrong!! As for any of his children marrying after 1901. I'm afraid I can't find any! Thanks everyone. I really do appreciate all the help. Chloe

Chloe Did any of their other children marry after 1901? If so, then do you have their marriage certs? This may help to narrow down the timeframe of at least James's death, as if he had died by the time of the marriage, the cert will usually say "deceased" under the father's name. Richard

Have you looked at ***** http://freebmd(.)rootsweb(.)com/ ***** remove the brackets. I have found these entries - James Edward Perrin - marriage June 1859 at Newington James Edward Perrin - died March 1882 St Albans

H Chloe, Searched 1837online 1900 - 1910 Looking for James Edward Perren No record. He would have been 75. I will do a further 10 years to-morrow. What ages run in the family? My lot were in the mid eighties. Interestingly my grandfather who was born in 1870 was a "Brushfinisher" I will get back to you. Leon

Thanks again. Have checked the US censuses. Nothing. Might have gone to Australia, but again, wouldn't this be mentioned, and why would they have emigrated at 60 plus years when they had built a life up for themselves in England. Thanks the the suggestion though. After looking at PERRIN's and PERREN's for about 50 years on the books, there was nothing that even remotely was like James and Maria. I was thinking perhaps James died and Maria remarried, but again, not found a death for James! Grrrr, wish the 1911 was out, at least then I could cut the search down by 10 years! I will try alternative spellings next time I go to the FRC, can't afford it on 1837!! Only ever had it spelt Perrin or Perren, so not sure who could have mis-spelt it because their children all stayed in the London area, and one of them would have registered it. As for how far I've gotten back on this tree, I've gotten back to 1756, where James Edward's grandfather James PERRIN was born and baptised in St Anne, Soho. Think they were Huguenots but will have to venture down that alley another day. Dread it when I get back to the times of the Great Fire, if I ever do, and the genealogy stops! Hate brickwalls!!! Chloe

Just had a thought. Could there be a chance they werent living in England or Wales when they died and had moved abroad. That might be worth considering.

I am skeptical they lived beyond 100 especially 60 odd years ago, and even now it is by luck people live to 100 now, and if they did, you would of heard about it through your nan or another relative. Another help tip is they could of moved. But at now the best thing to do is check alternate spellings. I also have ancestors who came from London and am focusing mainly on them than any other ancestral lines, and am struggling on one branch after the 6th generation. Genealogy is so frustarting at times, so I know what it is like when you hit these brick walls and just wanna smash 'em down.

Thanks you two. Don't worry Leon, I have the details of the censuses. It's after 1901 where they seem to disappear. I haven't checked Pirren etc spellings, so will try and give that a go. I have their births (James registered at Dr Williams' Library on 22nd July 1835 and Maria was born at Hope Square, Weymouth on 8th April 1838), marriage (June 1859 at St Mary, Newington), just their deaths I'm missing. I have them on the 1871, 1881, 1891 and 1901. They might have lived over 100 but I don't know if that is very likely. After 1940 they would have been 105 and 102. That's pretty old. My nana never mentioned them being alive when she married their grandson, Bert (in 1932). Their son, Ernest (my g grandfather) married in October 1901, his father is still alive at that time. Any more help?

Hi Chloe, Not sure how much you have on them. I have them on the 1881 census with 8 children. He was a Tramway Conductor then. They maried in 1859. On the 1901 they give his age as 55 but on the 1881 they say he was born in 1836. Maria was given as being born in Weymouth Dorset. I have the kids details if you want it. Leon

Hi Chloe Dont forget that in civil registration indexes are no more immune to human error than anything else, and some records were either garbled or simply missed, but I doubt that would of happened to both of your gg grandparents deaths. Maybe they were known by different names as opposed to the ones given in the census, people were often known by their middle name or simply a nickname. The best thing to do is check other spellings besides Perren and Perrin, ie Pirren or Perin even. By the way, how old were they in 1901 as the could of lived to their 80s and 90s and died after 1940 Hope this helps Ben

Sorry Leon. James and Maria lived most of their lives in London/Surrey area. Maria was born in Dorset though. They're in Islington in 1901. James was a brushmaker for most of his life. All of their 8 children survived infancy. Moved out to Kent, Essex etc. There's no photos on my side of the family of them. I have a photo of their son, my g grandfather, Ernest Frederick Perren in 1931 (he was born in 1876). Ernest died in 1940 in St Albans. I assume that they died before then, but I can't find it anywhere! Is this enough info?