Genealogy Chat

Have just found out on the 1881 census(Dont know why I didnt think of it before) that the registrar who is on phlips death certificate has ..occupation, registrar births deaths etc(Steyning union) so it looks like Philip did die in Shoreham workhouse infirmary, so I will now look for likely burial sites in Shoreham. Many thanks to all who replied. Sheila.

Sheila, Sorry, I can't find anything on the NBI. As Nell says, it is far from complete, but anything is worth a try. Carole

THANKYOU so much everyone, including Grant who E mailed me, and hopes to help too. I am still open to further suggestions, and have lots of things to research now.As to whether my GGG died in Brighton or Shoreham is now the question.The registrar was a man called Spearing, and the doctor who signed the certificate Herbert C. Upton. so maybe they will appear in trade directories of the day, and I can see where they were based.Historical directories website. may have enries for 1882. Sheila.

Valerie National Burial Index. It is not complete (some counties aren't included at all). nell

thanks for answering me where do I find that site

Hi Maggie, You have got me thinking..never would have thought of that ..it is very possible that his landlord may not have wanted a sick man on his hands who couldn't pay his rent.Philip died aged 56 after having pneumonia for 8 days. Another twist in the story. Philips wife gave birth to a son in a Manchester workhouse in 1866, just before Philip went bankrupt, and maybe the shame stayed with their son, so as you suggest, he may have done the decent thing by his Father. thankyou so much for your input.I have lots of things to investigate. Sheila. Have just checked workhouse website, and Shoreham did have a workhouse.Records are held at East Sussex records office.Death records are missing, but admissions for 1882 are available.

Sheila, Is it possible he actually died in a hospital /workhouse in Shoreham? If he was ill, his landlord may have had him admitted, and when his son registered his death gave his last 'decent' address? If he died in Shoreham, the cheapest option would to have had him buried there. Maggie

Hi John, Funny you should mention undertakers..Sheila (ist Message) has just e mailed me to say she has looked in the phone book for any undertakers established in 1882, in their adverts, but no luck, and she says there are far too many to contact in the Brighton area, but she has given me several churches with graveyards in the Providence place, Vere Road areas, that may hold his remains, so if all else fails I'll phone them. I was very low this morning, but after so many positive ideas, I shall plough on. I've come this far after all. Thanks everyone. love Sheila.

Hi Lindsey. His death certificate states registration district Steyning, sub district Shoreham, county of Sussex, and address of death 8 Providence Place,,Hove USD, and his son lived at 16 Vere Road, Preston, and he registered the death.I cant comment on these districts as I know very little about the area. Many thanks Sheila.

Long shot and a lot of work esp. if you don't live in Brighton but try local undertakers. some do keep records

i would check if he was buried somewhere else, have you checked where his death was registered? may be his daughter did take over the arrangement and he was buried in salford. if so the main ones were agecroft and weaste. agecroft hold the records for both, it may be worth a try. good luck anyway:-)

Hi Sheila, I will take a look when I get home from work and let you know what (if) I find. Carole

If anyone could check the NBI I should be very grateful. His name was Philip Christian Stortz, born 1826, and his son Camile Roman Stortz died in Lambeth in 1925. I know where Philips daughter is buried, and Philip is not in her grave. Most of his other children were buried in Birkenhead and Manchester, but I do not know where his two wives Isabella and Margaret were buried. Isabella is in Salford Lancs on the 1871 census. Grateful thanks Sheila.

Has anyone checked the NBI for him? Carole

Hi Karen, Bob. just looked on Graveyard site, but as yet nothing for Brighton, but will definately keep my eye on it, thanks. Bob... I had thought it was a possibilityhe could have been buried somewhere else.He was born in Germany, and came to London when he first arrived in England, and then lived in Liverpool, Salford, Manchester, Birkenhead , and on the 1881 census is back in Middlesex.He is a widower on that census, and his daughter, my great gran was a domestic servant in Manchester, so I thought it most likely that his son, who didn't live too far away from the address of lodgings in Brighton where he died, would have ben the most likely one to have arranged the funeral. This ancestor has been a real mystery right from the start. he would have not had much money, as for the last 6 years of his life he seemed to lodge with other people, even though he was a very talented artist and Photographer. and didnt seem to recover after his bankruptcy in 1867 and the deaths of 6 of his children. Thankyou for the input Sheila

You say he was in Brighton only a few years. Could he have been taken back to a family site elsewhere? bob

Sheila Just remembered there was a message on the records board about people who were willing to visit local graveyards. Type graveyard in the search string and it should come up. Hopefully the area you want is listed and someone can check the graveyards for you. Karen

Hi Karen, Yes the local obtiuaries were checked, I dont know how thoroughly, by a contact I had several years ago, but he reckoned he found nothing. My GGG seems to have only been in Brighton a short while, so maybe his son didn't think it was worth putting anything in the paper. Thankyou for the input..greatly appreciated. Sheila

Sheila Have you tried to see if there were an obituary messages placed in local newspapers at the time which might have given details about his death and funeral arrangements? Karen

Hi Sheila Providence Place is central Brighton..Im not sure why it's down as Hove. I will e-mail you Sheila