Genealogy Chat

Looking for any more with regards to my great grandfather, My grandfather never met him and knows nothing about him. Until recently we didn't even know his name but I'm having trouble in finding any records of him other than the info below which is what's on my grandfathers birth certificate.

Grandfather - Terence James brown born 1944
His father - Frederick Henry brown
Occupation - 1548610 lance corporal Royal artillery electrician
Mother- Florence Mabel Brown formerly Johnson
Mother residence- Plot 18 the warren Gronant

Would like to see if I could find marriage, death, even war entry .
It is possible he was a bigamist but not sure if that's true or not.
Thank you any help appreciated.

https://www.francisfrith.com/uk/gronant/gronant-the-warren-1939_g167021

https://en-gb.facebook.com/groups/175501525929780/

(A Pictorial History of Prestatyn, Gronant & Meliden is on Facebook)

https://en-gb.facebook.com/groups/175501525929780/permalink/1156158347864088/

(meliden primary school about 1951-3ish front row L-R terry brown)


Gronant is a village in Flintshire, Wales about 2 miles east of Prestatyn

Meliden is a village between Prestatyn and Dyserth in Denbighshire, Wales.

(for info. area, from google)

Chris :)

Royal Artillery attestations 1883-1942 Transcription (Find My Past)

First name(s) Frederick Henry
Last name Brown
Attestation year 1938
Service number 1548610

(if her below)

Flintshire Burials Transcription (Find My Past)

First name(s) Florence Mabel
Last name Brown
Age 80
Birth year 1909
Burial year 1989
Burial date 11 May 1989
Place Meliden
Parish Meliden
County Flintshire
Country Wales


England & Wales deaths 1837-2007 Transcription (Find My Past)

First name(s) FLORENCE MABEL
Last name BROWN
Gender Female
Birth day 26
Birth month 1
Birth year 1909
Death quarter 2
Death year 1989
District Rhuddlan
Register number 589
County Flintshire
Volume 24
Page 523

Thank you Chris much appriciated.

There were two Florence Mabel Johnsons born in the right quarter to fit that DOB:

Births Mar 1909 (>99%)
JOHNSON Florence Mabel B.Stortford 3a 729 (mms Turner)
JOHNSON Florence Mabel Shoreditch 1c 32 (mms Corne)

I don't see any marriage to a Frederick Brown.

Here's the Shoreditch Florence in 1911:


Florance Mabel Johnson
in the 1911 England Census
Name: Florance Mabel Johnson
Age in 1911: 2
Estimated birth year: abt 1909
Relation to Head: Daughter
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Shoreditch
Civil Parish: Shoreditch
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 56 Buckland Street, Hoxton N
Registration district: Shoreditch
Registration District Number: 16
Sub-registration district: Shoreditch South
ED, institution, or vessel: 15
Piece: 1336
Household Members:
Name Age
William Frederick Johnson 29
Elizabeth Johnson 26
Elizabeth May Johnson 4
Florance Mabel Johnson 2
Louisa Johnson 0

I think Florence was from London and possibly had something to do with the pearlie kings and queens or so some family members seem to think. Xx

(not Terence on that photo added above is it, no idea of areas here!)

Chris :)

(for that Florence, London Baptisms, Ancestry, only up to 1906)

Chris :)

London, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921 (Ancestry)

Name: William Frederick Johnson (occ. Labourer)
Estimated birth year: abt 1881
Age: 23
Spouse: Elizabeth Corne
Spouse Age: 19
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 26 Jun 1904
Parish: St Anne, Shoreditch
Borough: Hackney
Father Name: William Frederick Johnson (occ. Labourer)
Spouse Father: Thomas Corne (occ. Fish Dealer)
Register Type: Parish Register
(Residence at Time, 41 Essex Street, for both)


(possible below)

1939 Register (Find My Past)

19 Ivy Walk , Shoreditch, London,
William F Johnson 18 Jun 1881 Male Bricklayer Heavy Worker Married (A.R.P. Stepney Depot. Rescue, Shoring, Demolition)
Elizabeth Johnson 11 Feb 1884 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married

Yes that is Terence. Thanks for the link no seen this photo.

Sorry should of said my grandfather had 2 sisters one older called Elaine and one younger called Carole.
After speaking to other family members I've discovered that Florence was possibly married before as she had 3 children from previous relationship. Jean, john and not sure of other name only it was a son.
John was married to Peggy.

Therefore would Johnson on my grandfathers birth certificate be her married or maiden name.

Is it possible that this was Florence's first marriage:-

First name(s) FLORENCE M
Last name JOHNSON
Marriage quarter 4
Marriage year 1927
Registration month -
MarriageFinder™ FLORENCE M JOHNSON married
John Woodcock
Spouse's last name Woodcock
District Shoreditch
District number -
County London
Country England
Volume 1C
Page 133
Record set England & Wales Marriages 1837-2005

There are these three possible children from that marriage:-

First name(s) JOHN F
Last name WOODCOCK
Birth year 1928
Birth quarter 2
Registration month -
Mother's last name Johnson
District Shoreditch
County London
Country England
Volume 1C
Page 111
Record set England & Wales Births 1837-2006

and:-

First name(s) WILLIAM G
Last name WOODCOCK
Birth year 1930
Birth quarter 3
Registration month -
Mother's last name Johnson
District Shoreditch
County London
Country England
Volume 1C
Page 85
Record set England & Wales Births 1837-2006

and:-

First name(s) GEORGINA (could she be known as Jean or Gina?)
Last name WOODCOCK
Birth year 1933
Birth quarter 1
Registration month -
Mother's last name Johnson
District Shoreditch
County London
Country England
Volume 1C
Page 85
Record set England & Wales Births 1837-2006

Not sure why she wouldn't have married your great-grandfather in her married name though.

Kath. x

Thank you will look into it.

Thank you will look into it.

this is a marriage for Frederick h brown to Florence m woodcock

Marriages Sep 1940   (>99%)

Brown
 Frederick H
 Woodcock
 Thurrock
 4a
2557
  

  
Woodcock
 Florence M
 Brown
 Thurrock
 4a
2557

Great thanks definitely looking like the right person. Really appreciate all the help. I've found florences brothers and sisters from the info given. Now trying to find any family etc for Frederick.

there are a few fredericks and brown is not a good name to find if you knew when and where he was born might help

Thanks for all the help. Need to review all info given and see what else from family I can possible dig out. Thanks again really appriciated the help.

The Brown/Woodcock marriage certificate might give you more clues. Frederick's age, for instance, and fathers name.

1939 Register


Brown (Woodcock) Household (4 People)

14 Grover Street , Southend-on-Sea C.B., Essex, England


John F Woodcock 25 May 1928 Male At School Single 297 2
>>>>Flora M Brown (Woodcock) 20 Jan 1909 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Widowed 297 1
William G Woodcock 20 Jul 1930 Male At School Single 297 3
?
Sorry, this record is officially closed. Check if you can open a closed record.

Liverpool Echo 8th January 1944

TWO BIGAMY CHARGES - Soldier who wore Africa Star Ribbon

Frederick Henry Brown aged 41, wearing the ribbon of the Africa Star appeared at Grays today on 2 charges of bigamy.
Miss Maud Rose Annie Ayling of Delphin Road, Redditch, said she met Brown when they were both working at the Kursaal, Southend in 1935 and they went through a form of marriage the same year at Lewisham.
Mrs F Woodcock of Litchfield House, Prestatyn, North Wales, said she was a widow with three children. She met Brown at Southend and 'married' him at Stanford le Hope, Essex. There were 2 children of the union.
Detective Bond read a statement made by Brown in which he said he was married to a girl named Rose Brown at Streatham about 1928. She went away with a hawker and he had not seen her since.
Brown, who said he was not going to plead guilty or not guilty until he found out if she were alive, was committed for trial at Essex Assizes, bail being allowed in the sum of £25.